I have been learning to do the paper patterns-templates.

well I have come across something that I thought very good thing, being I like to save money, be frugal if you will.
with the fantastic way to make an octagon by Riversong,

paper was just not my thing,

BUT, I have the manila folders which I was going to throw away, got a bunch.... anyway I tried it, it is firm enough, but not as stiff as cardboard, or flimsy as paper. And the octagon came out just fine, now to do other patterns!
and start my project for Christmas.