How does one know if a block is in public domain or not?

I think it would be very hard to come up with the original "original" for most of the blocks using straight-edged pieces.

Good question!

Wouldn't that be an awesome website to be able to access :D

anything pre 1927 is the public domain but then lets say you come up with a sampler quilt that uses traditional blocks from public domain you can copyright that pattern in that specific layout and sell the pattern to the public.

here are a couple of interesting articles i found on the web. i just did a new search because the two i used to refer to are not longer available.

http://tabberone.com/Trademarks/Copy...uiltThis.shtml

i was particularly tickled by this article because our board is mentioned several times. who knew we were so famous? :lol:

http://tabberone.com/Trademarks/Copy...Quilting.shtml

Patricia, I just read those articles and found them very interesting. They answered a lot of questions that i had.

Thanks!

We are slowly covering the globe, why not be universally famous, too??? 8) 8) 8) 8) 8) 8)

Thanks for the links Patrice, I enjoyed reading them, it was nice to read a legal article that was not legalese :D :D :D

with regard to the second link, i absolutely believe that everyone has an axe to grind.

so, what is theirs?

you know I also have a question on this for instance on the Stack and Whack method by Bethany Reynolds a very fun quilt to do then out comes someone with one block wonder same eveverything except cutting method changed and block setting changed otherwise same pattern so really is copyright nonly for certain people I am really curious

Hey! I am famous!! I am "Another Poster"!!!! Woohoo! Anyone want my autograph?

will it be worth money someday? if yes, then yes!

LOL! Probably not.

then PTHOOOT!! :evil:

Ahaha! Back at ya!

:lol: :lol:

Very interesting articles....who'd have thought quilting could be so dangerous and exciting...Lisa T, who designed those cherries on your avatar??? Oh, dear I'm using Van Gogh's Starry Starry Night....I was hoping to quilt it one day....Ah well it will have to stay in the closet and be worked upon in secrecy....

OMG!! I want to quilt Starry Night, too! I even have a small poster of it in my sewing stuff. Too funny. Do you think they'll let us stay at the same prison?

As far as my cherries- I think I am safe because it's an antique design from the 30's, so that would put it in the public realm I believe. I got it out of a Good Housekeeping book, so maybe they re-copywrote it? My quilt looks far different from the one in the book and the cherries are the only thing that I used from the pattern. Maybe this is a derivitive "work"... is a derivitive work illegal?

I hope they let me quilt in prison! (Can you imagine- how much sewing time would I have there!??? But probably no scissors...)

I've wondered about the original designs using traditional blocks that I have posted here. I love sharing them and the feedback that I get for changes and improvements. There is no way to prevent someone from copying from a picture. I know that using EQ6 I can re-create a quilt exactly from a picture.

This whole issue is very confusing to me. I guess that as long as I'm not selling anything...they won't lock me up???

I hate all the confusion about copywriting. In the painting and stained glass world, I BELIEVE (note: I believe) the interpretation is that if I don't copy the pattern, then try to sell the pattern as my own design, then I'm not in the wrong. The exception in some of the books are that if I were to take the pattern and manufacture a lot (like the quilts made overseas) and sold them cheaply, I could be in trouble.
I think it would be VERY hard to claim a quilt block design is my own design...so many are old time versions of blocks. The appliqueing or picture quilts would be a different story. In the meantime, I'm not designing quilts (I'm not that talented) and I'm using patterns from books or kits. :mrgreen:

well i think the key here is the money.

if you're reproducing something for your home or friends no one is going to charge you with a crime.

if you start making money that should have been in their pocket then they might come after you.

tons of people reproduce music in their home and it never becomes an issue until its released to the public and makes money.

From the second article:

"If you make pictures of the finished quilt, then I think there is likely to be a problem..." That depends upon the purpose of the pictures. If you have made the quilt from a lawfully acquired pattern, that pattern purchase gives you the rights to the item made from that pattern. Your quilt; your pictures of your quilt. If you want to sell the quilt, copyright law specifically gives you permission to use pictures to sell it.

"Finally, don't make money off anyone else's work" Why not? If you purchased the pattern you have that right. They voluntarily sold it to you. NASCAR drivers don't build their own cars; they buy Fords and Pontiacs and modify them. They have that right. Don't you think Ford dislikes when the race is won by a Pontiac? But imagine Ford saying "This car can only be used for non-commercial home use". Profit is a perfectly reasonable motive and is recognized under the law.

In a follow-up post she says, "Again, it's not the creation of the potholders that matters, it's trying to sell them." Wrong, wrong, wrong. It is perfectly legal to do so and we have established that fact in lawsuits against Disney, Major League Baseball, Sanrio, and United Media (Peanuts). There is absolutely no court case that says otherwise

Me again... that goes for the pattern and any copywritted fabric that is used in the pattern. I just can't start printing copies of the pattern or make the fabric and sell it.

If a piano player at a restaurant plays a song then I believe that they would have to purchase a copy of the sheet music? Doesn't that give them the right to then play it in public and they are getting paid for it? That doesn't mean that they can commercially release a CD of copywritten songs but they can play them in public, right?

My not so humble but honest opinion if you're interested...

"There really is nothing new under the sun." You've all heard that, right? Well, if I make a quilt - or any other craft - through a magazine, book, or other meduim, how am I to know that particular item does not exist somewhere else on this planet? Last year I tossed out mags (sewing and cross stitch - gasp!) that went back 20 years (not 20 years worth, just some I've had that long) because the patterns were simply reproduced. Ever sew an a-line dress? You tell me what the diff is between an a-line dress pattern by Simp, McCalls, or Vogue. Same with doll clothes patterns, they are childrens patterns only smaller. What about fabric yo-yo's? Or real ones? Everything is copied. Are there really 101 ways to cook hamburg? Yuck.

You must have been to craft fairs where the fad of the time was sold - sock dolls, fabric bowls, clown dolls, cable-knit sweaters, painted rocks, beaded jewelry. I don't think these people got permission from The First Person To Make The First One to sell these items. And to take this one step further, how do we know that these books, mags, or internet patterns aren't copied from someone else? What about 1930's reproduction quilts? Same thing, right? Let's take an old whatever and reproduce it.

I'm beginning to think this entire copyright issue is more liability protection, similar to peanut or egg warning labels. You can't possibly cover all situations, so you generalize with a "law" that is so vague no one seems to be able to offer a globally understood, direct explanation. If copyright is that much of an issue, the definition should be as understandable as 2+2=4, and not subject to as much interpretation and question as it is.

(edited) I also believe that it is reproducing and selling the pattern itself, and not your result or interpretation of that pattern. Just about every pattern book I have has the disclaimer that says something to the effect of "we are not responsible for the actual end result, based on the crafter's choice of materials, products, abilities..." etc. So how can it possibly be a copyright infringement?

Whew.

The author of the Dear Jane book is DIRECTLY copying the designs of the original book.

And Jane Stickney probably copied some of her designs from some she'd seen elsewhere.

The original Jane has been long dead, Even though the author is giving Jane full credit for the designs - where is the line between homage and plagiarism?

I just think most of the geometric designs have been around for so long, that it is hard to know the "true" source (I happen to think it's the Creator, but that's another line of thought)

my entire life is surrounded by musicians and not one of them buys sheet music.

you don't need to once a song is released to the public anyone can doing it live.

some one could hear a song on the radio this afternoon and play it live in the club tonight.

the problem comes when you decide to release the song for money (CD, download, etc) then you need approval.

and she now has that copyright because of her book.

paula nadelstern was in a lawsuit with, i believe, hilton hotels because they had a rug in houston that looked like her quilt.

hilton's attorney argued that since she used copywritten fabric that her quilt was not protected by that copyright and that the book it was published in did not get permission to use the fabric for commercial (read for profit) use.

they settled out of court which is a shame because i would love to know what a judge thought about the issue.

I bet she would have won. Like the case sited in that link, a store was selling bedding made with Precious Moments fabric. The makers of the fabric sued and lost. You purchase the fabric, you have the right to USE it however you see fit. That doesn't negate your copywrite to your work with that fabric. That is so ridiculous! If a clothing designer purchases a fabric do they then have to give the fabric manufacturer a cut of the sales? I don't think so.

just because something is legal doesn't make it morally right

morals is a subjective state without laws its nothing. what some consider moral is not considered that way by everyone.

this is why there are laws and judges to pass the judgement. it is not up to me to decide what is moral to someone else.

well paula went out and side a contract with benartex and puts out a fabric line (something she never wanted to do in her life) and now she only uses fabrics from her line to do her work.

clearly she was very concerned by this issue.

I am very aware of that - one of my sons is gay. And what is considered
"moral" at one time in one place, may not be so in another time and another place.


The point of my starting this thread was that so many of the geometric type designs seem to have very ancient origins - and it seems to me that for someone later on to claim that it's original to him is a stretch.

A lot of our "how-to" is learned from others and expanded upon with our own experience -

If I pay for a class - is it wrong for me to show someone else how to do that technique? If I lend or give them the materials, is that okay? It's not being copied.

Is it wrong for a library to lend a book out? If 100 people borrowed it, the author/publishing house only got a royalty payment for one book.

If something seems truly distinctive and/or original, or it's too complicated to try to figure out, I am more than willing to pay for the pattern. I'm not that creative in some areas and it's way too cumbersome to try to re-invent the wheel.

http://thequiltshow.com/os/blog.php/blog_id/1960

"The point of my starting this thread was that so many of the geometric type designs seem to have very ancient origins - and it seems to me that for someone later on to claim that it's original to him is a stretch. "

this is a quote by bearisgray. the above link demonstrates exactly what she is saying. can anyone copyright that? even if they put it in a book? in a quilt? change the colors? puh-leeze. gimme a break.

Lisa, does that mean you used up your fifteen minutes of fame?
You didn't exactly volunteer...so, wonder if you'll get another shot.
What do you want to be famous for? :roll: :D

Man, am I glad to hear somebody say this! I am a reasonably intelligent person, but I read this stuff, and don't feel like it added much of anything to my understanding.
Maybe, some of us, just find it all, so boring, and I'm not looking to steal anything from anybody...I JUST WANT TO QUILT!!! :cry: sniff, sniff
...Patti, as long as they didn't see us,...they can't prove a thing!
That's my story, and I'm sticking to it!:D