From cradle to grave in one institution after another vs cradle to grave at home
 

Some folks have babies at home some would never think of it and in fact would rather have a Caesarian birth or other institutional type birth. Some babies are laid on the floor on a home made quilt to explore and wiggle about some are in confined in a walker. I see people hauling babies in a seat rather than carry them or using a carrier. When they are big enough to walk they confine them to a stroller - some until ridiculous age, too... Do they get tired too easily because they don't get enough exercise? Or are they confined because they aren't disciplined enough not to run off. Some put a baby or small child in day care some keep them home. At home do they play with toys and computers or do they manipulate real things? Are kids taught how to work? How to sew? How to cook? How about food? Are they eating nuggets or real chicken? Do they eat fast food or convenience food? Do they dig in the dirt or keep the designer clothes clean all the time? Do they run barefoot through the grass? How about education? At home? Daycare? Hybrid like home and preschool? Computers? No computers? Do they read a book or watch it as a movie? Home education or institutional education? Is a first choice for a vacation an amusement park or a state park? Even then tent or RV? Making music or listening to canned music? Is religion confined to a building or a regular part of life? What about career? Institution or self employment? Job in huge corporation or job with smaller company? Heath care from institutional doctor or alternative medicine? Old age care at home or nursing home? Death with tubes and wires or not? Comfort care or life supports?

life is full of choices, isn't it? and very few of them are right or wrong [thinking of the illegal things in the wrong category :) ]

Like it or not we all fall into one institution or another...

As the grandmother of a child with autism I've learned not to judge the parenting of others. Decisions are made based on individual circumstances. This also applies to my two parents in assisted living. I know my limitations and could never give them the care they're getting.

and the point is......

sandy

If a child is loved and cared for it doesn't matter if he is in a walker, stroller, in day care or public school. Same with elderly in assisted living or hospital. Living changes decade to decade. What was norm for the 50's cannot be done today on a daily basis. I for one will not burden my kids with my care as I age. It puts a noose around their necks loaded with guilt. Thank goodness there are assisted living facilities.

Be the visitor...not the caregiver...referri g to nursing homes.NO ONE ever wants to have to make that decision but we had to. My mom would never had wanted to be a burden on her kids. Sadly she needed nursing home care. We visited often and for hours on end. So glad she is at Peace though we miss her terribly. Watching her decline was heartbreaking. Mom fully understood life cycles and the cold hard truth. Just knowing her wishes carried us through.

sandy

I think each person who reads Miriam's thought provoking posts from the wee hours of the morning will come up with "the point" that applies to him or her. I see it as something akin to the prose of CD in Oklahoma.

I believe most people do the best they can do at the time and under the circumstances.
There is never a perfect solution to any of the things you talk about.

...so Miriam, what is your answer to your questions.....

I used to think of a young child in a walking harness (strap) as looking like you were walking your dog. Then when my youngest son who was very active was little and we lived in Ca and at that time, there were a lot of kidnappings of little blue eyed, blonde haired kids, that someone distracted them for a second while someone else ran off with thier kid, well, I changed my mind and my son (the fourth) went into an wrist strap. It was better than him ending up on a milk carton. When my grandson was little, even though it was really rough on me due to back reasons, I carried him in a carseat, I have a siezure disorder and if I went down, I'd rather him be in the carseat with some protection than in my arms where he could get severly hurt. I've only had 4 in over 20 yrs but not guarntee I won't have another or some other problem. The point is, we don't know why people make the choices they do, rather its put their kids in daycare or our loved ones in a nursing home. I used to run a daycare and I know at least one mom who was a much better parent because she got that break away from her very hyper 2 yr old. I'd rather not ever be put in a nursing home but not at the expense of my kids hardships if that was the option. Life is hard and we all have to make hard decisions but have to remember that some have no other choice.

I agree that children don't get enough outside time, but then neither do adults according to the rapid rise in Vit D defency. I pray that no one suffers at the decisions that some one else makes on their part but it does happen; Unfortunetly. My grandkids have all the computer games etc, but they are limited on them and never if thier behavior and grades are up to what they should be.

Sorry for going on. Its just that I wanted to say not to judge without knowing why people do what they do. Rather we agree or not.

Where has CD been? I haven't seen any thing from him in a very long time.

Yes, I agree, what point applies to you?
I, too had an autism spectrum child and now some DGKs as well with varying degrees of issues - each have been dealt with differently. I tried the harness and it was a nightmare... Not judging...
One in-law chose assisted living - parents made other choices. None are easy, convenient or necessarily to everyone's advantage. As mentioned above, it is choices that have to be made then lived with.
Life gets dirty some times doesn't it.
Every choice has consequences.
I guess it is a matter of what makes you feel you did the right thing - but is it?

Yea, times have changed since we were young. Some changes better some worse in my little mind. But then I do not live the life my parents or grandparents did at the age I am at now. Life was simpler yet harder back then. We have so much more accessible to us. I want the best of both ages. Sometimes it just does not work that way in these times. Too many laws and so much evil to worry about now. All we can do is give it our best and embrace the world we are in today

I've had the most disgusting evening cleaning up vomit... and not mine.

Miriam, I guess that is one thing that has not changed through the ages. Hope better health comes soon to the poor soul you are caring for

Sounds like vertigo. I've had a lot of experience cleaning up and I'd much prefer that to having no control and suffering from a whirly world, been there too. May you find strength and patience as you need it.

Near as I can tell it was from trying to drink the dreaded thickened liquid while leaning side ways and a good gag then oops.

What direction in general do you think thins are trending? For you? Toward more institutions or more toward home? It seems like it is a topic people feel strongly about... Like I said I don't have good answers and the answers I have are subject to change.

You can't judge a lifestyle by what you see from the outside. Unless you see or know there is neglect or abuse, let families be. And just for the record, those older children you see in strollers and/or walkers may have disabilities and be unable to walk and the majority of the elderly in nursing homes are there because they have special needs that can't be provided to them at home and not because the families don't want to take care of them. Life is full of choices and we all get to make our own.

I am sorry that I have no clue to what you are dealing with. I assume it is an ailing, declining mother? Based on your tag line with your identity on QB.
Sandy

This really isn't about specifics.

When our only son was little we used to take him to restaurants and movies. One theater had a cry baby room he just slept through the movie! We took him to restaurants so he would know how to behave in one. We even had a baby carrier on my husbands bike. We used to take him to the base to go shopping. When he was older he worked at the skating rink on Lakenteh Base in Japan so he could buy his own TV and record player.

My mom and dad stayed at home. My sister gave up her nursing career to stay with them. I went to their home in Puerto Rico 4 times a year to give my sister some time to go to the beach and visit with her family in NY. They were pretty stable and did not get dementia until the end and that was probably caused more by heart problems than anything else. They both died peacefully at home. My MIL was another story. She had dementia for about 10 years and went from being a nice gentle soul to being a terrible tyrant with a vocabulary that would shame a sailor. We had caregiver after caregiver quit after she hit them or spit at them and never mind about the names she called them. She was vicious with my DH and but for some reason spared me other than racial epithets. She became sneakier and sneakier and escaped from the house repeatedly in the night. One night we found her by our pond. We lived on a ranch and very few neighbors and it was frightening when she escaped although we had latches and locks all over the place. She threw food and although she was continent she would do her business on the floor and step in it so it went all over the house. When my DH retired, this stopped somewhat but it was insane at our house. We had no visitors because we never knew what would happen when they were there. We ended up being prisoners. My only escape was to go to work part time so that we could afford the caregiver. After 7 years, she went to an assisted care facility. We were very active with the facility and I have to say they were wonderful. I went twice a week and taught a quilting class for the residents and staff. My DH visited daily. We are grateful for the assisted living facility/nursing home. When she deteriorated further, she went into the nursing home part of the facility and we visited there frequently too. It makes a difference if you go there to be with your family member. I hate to say that when she passed it was a blessing because we still miss her and love the her that was before the dementia kicked in.

Yes this!

I for one was born at home, birthed my babies at home and plan to die at home if it is possible.

Struggling with dad's future care as I type. Very tough year for him medically. I am currently with him (several states from home) so that sis can have a break. Two sibs are local to him and 2 of us are not. Tough situations as well as choices. Each person...those needing care and those providing it....have different needs and circumstances. What is right for you and yours may not be the same for me or any of our neighbors. We can only hope to make the best decisions based on available information at the time. Sometimes those decisions might need go be reevaluated after time, but only time will tell.

Deep breaths. Repeat many times per hour. Change is tough.

I wish our government was as wise as you are. I have watched lousy parents abuse kids for years, and never hear from CPS, and have seen good parents lose their children to the government. I have watched the government give children to folks I would not leave alone with my dog. I have hear d CPS workers casually mention that all foster children develop "attachment disorders" as if discussing the weather. Nothing is ever done to prevent or treat it. Government needs to get out of the business of children and let communities go back to raising children. Before the government got involved, we had children who respected parents, rules, teachers, and themselves, not we have whole generations u able to cope with life. Most of them are now on disability, or living in the streets. The system is broken and so is our future. Makes me glad to be old. I won't be here when the results of electronic babysitters comes home to roost.

I don't have children so I'm living on the assumption that when DH & I get old enough we're going to have to arrange for a paid caretaker or live in some sort of assisted living facility. I am trying to save up accordingly, so I can end up somewhere decent in my sunset years. I'm hoping some sort of personal assistant robots will be a reality by then, to help prolong my self reliance period, but who knows what will happen? I hope my niece and/or nephew will help keep an eye on us so we won't be taken advantage of when our minds start to lose touch with reality, since we won't have kids of our own to watch out for us.

There's a really nice senior assisted-living facility in my area that puts on an annual quilt show. It is very nice and clean and they have lovely gardens, and the residents seem happy and active. I hope I can afford somewhere like that, when it's time for me to live with help! I wouldn't mind living there now! LOL

I think her "point" was to start a discussion and thought. It worked.

Sometimes the individual can choose, then there are often times someone else has to make the choice for the individual. May not always be preferred but often needed. The consequences are often not to the liking of others.

I found strollers wonderful. I had two children 11 months apart and a husband in the Navy. I do not know how I could have managed without a stroller. I could take the children for walks, shopping, visiting. Children are much safer in crowds in a stroller, in summer not as hot against someone's body, in the winter, safer if the ground is slippery and you take a fall holding them. Also, back problems can be an issue. I used a play pen to keep the chldren safe if I needed to used the bathroom, or change laundry loads, or some other task when I felt they were too young to be left unattended. My children were loved and well-cared for. I applaud parents who use whatever they need to enjoy their children, keep them safe and nuture them. Judge NOT....maybe I was not perfect, but I tried and my children grew up safe and are wonderful parents and productive members of society.

I honestly think that you won't know what you will do until the situation is at your doorstep. Well meaning people have said that they won't do this, or they just couldn't do that, that is until "this or that" presented its self..Life is what it is and you just can't say for sure what the future holds.