1921 Singer 66 Bobbin roller issue
02-02-2020, 07:25 AM
#1
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1921 Singer 66 Bobbin roller issue
I hope someone can help with a bobbin issue I'm having with my 1921 Singer Model 66 (red dot) treadle sewing machine. It was my grandmother's (purchased new in 1923). The bobbin roller will not touch the spoked hand wheel. I can see that someone wrapped layers of tape long ago on the hand wheel where the roller is supposed to touch. The tape is well worn away and I want to restore to original function. Bobbins are the normal "modern" style (not the shuttle)
Singer serial# G9031407. Bobbin housing #32673. Original simco blue roller, 1.17" in diameter and in good shape. All mechanical function of the bobbin winder is correctly adjusted and operational (and at it's maximum adjustment distance). Hand wheel inside diameter (where the roller should touch) is 2.93 inches. But for the roller to touch the wheel, it would have to take up a gap of 0.2 inches (the hand wheel would need to have a diameter of 3.3 inches".
I'm a very mechanical person and I just cannot see what's the issue. I searched the internet for days looking at pictures and my machine looks like all the others, except this winder is hopelessly off from working. In fact if I take out the adjuster screw and move the roller assembly down as far as it will go, the left side of the mechanism hits the sewing maching body just as the roller makes contact with the hand wheel.
Singer serial# G9031407. Bobbin housing #32673. Original simco blue roller, 1.17" in diameter and in good shape. All mechanical function of the bobbin winder is correctly adjusted and operational (and at it's maximum adjustment distance). Hand wheel inside diameter (where the roller should touch) is 2.93 inches. But for the roller to touch the wheel, it would have to take up a gap of 0.2 inches (the hand wheel would need to have a diameter of 3.3 inches".
I'm a very mechanical person and I just cannot see what's the issue. I searched the internet for days looking at pictures and my machine looks like all the others, except this winder is hopelessly off from working. In fact if I take out the adjuster screw and move the roller assembly down as far as it will go, the left side of the mechanism hits the sewing maching body just as the roller makes contact with the hand wheel.
02-02-2020, 10:57 AM
#2
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Does the winder on your machine have a black rubber tire? I am used to model 66 with motor and lights, and the bobbin winder clicks down to the left of the chromed edge on the hand wheel. You might need to oil and clean quite a bit if joints and hinges are stuck, it should click in place and release with ease. Some treadles have the bobbin winder running on the treadle belt, if so you have bobbin winder with out a bobbin tire.
In theory you might have the wrong winder, but if your machine has had one owner, I guess it has original parts. Model 66 was made for 50 or 60 years, and went through many minor changes over the decades. Theres probably more than two types of winders for model 66. You might get more accurate help if you post a picture.
In theory you might have the wrong winder, but if your machine has had one owner, I guess it has original parts. Model 66 was made for 50 or 60 years, and went through many minor changes over the decades. Theres probably more than two types of winders for model 66. You might get more accurate help if you post a picture.
Last edited by Mickey2; 02-02-2020 at 11:08 AM.
02-02-2020, 02:59 PM
#5
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I don't have a 66 at the moment, the closest I have is a 99K, and a belt driven 201K with a spoked wheel. The bobbin winder is in theory the same, but not spot on your treadle.
If the bobbin wheel presses down on the belt (or the groove in the hand wheel where the belt goes) it's not suppose to have a rubber tyre. If it presses on the metal part next to the belt, it is suppose to have a rubber tire. A black tire looks good on your machine, I think the gray/blue, beige even green came later to suite different finishes.
I'm unfortunately not much help with the treadle details. It looks like there is only one adjustment screw on my machines. With a bit of further investigation and research you will get to the problem. From the picture it looks like the winder can be adjusted a bit lower, but I may be thinking wrong from just looking at the picture.
If the bobbin wheel presses down on the belt (or the groove in the hand wheel where the belt goes) it's not suppose to have a rubber tyre. If it presses on the metal part next to the belt, it is suppose to have a rubber tire. A black tire looks good on your machine, I think the gray/blue, beige even green came later to suite different finishes.
I'm unfortunately not much help with the treadle details. It looks like there is only one adjustment screw on my machines. With a bit of further investigation and research you will get to the problem. From the picture it looks like the winder can be adjusted a bit lower, but I may be thinking wrong from just looking at the picture.
Last edited by Mickey2; 02-02-2020 at 03:03 PM.
02-02-2020, 05:45 PM
#6
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Welcome. It warms my heart for people to sew with machines they have inherited. The
It is a good thing it is different than the one Mickey linked to. I'm pretty sure no one could wind a bobbin with that one. The 'official' name for that decal set is "Scroll (red)" . While many call it a 'Red Eye,' from my understanding, the Singer employees would refer it to "Red Head" decal set.
Thank you for the picture. I'm going to post pictures differently. You will need to either click on the thumbnail & when done looking will have to use the "back arrow" to come back to the post. Or you can right click each thumbnail and open them in a new tab. Or you can click the linkes below and they will open in a new tab. (At least that is how it works on my computer.)
Last spring I acquired a 66-1 that only had a partial bobbin winder. Interestingly enough, two weeks before, I had gotten a 66 that I actually bought for the case it was in. It had a good bobbin winder, so I switched them. I'm thinking that perhaps if you loosen the screw that I have circled in yellow and adjust the piece (the whole winder) under the screw so that the opening is toward the hand wheel you might have better luck?
https://www.quiltingboard.com/attach...1&d=1580693966
and when the bobbin winder is in position for winding the bobbin the wheel will ride on the hub of the hand wheel, not in the n groove for the belt as shown be the right yellow arrow. The left arrow is the position it would be in for winding the bobbin if there was one there.
https://www.quiltingboard.com/attach...1&d=1580693977
I saw something the other day about putting what I call broccoli rubber bands over the bobbin winder tire.
Janey - Neat people never make the exciting discoveries I do.
It is a good thing it is different than the one Mickey linked to. I'm pretty sure no one could wind a bobbin with that one. The 'official' name for that decal set is "Scroll (red)" . While many call it a 'Red Eye,' from my understanding, the Singer employees would refer it to "Red Head" decal set.
Thank you for the picture. I'm going to post pictures differently. You will need to either click on the thumbnail & when done looking will have to use the "back arrow" to come back to the post. Or you can right click each thumbnail and open them in a new tab. Or you can click the linkes below and they will open in a new tab. (At least that is how it works on my computer.)
Last spring I acquired a 66-1 that only had a partial bobbin winder. Interestingly enough, two weeks before, I had gotten a 66 that I actually bought for the case it was in. It had a good bobbin winder, so I switched them. I'm thinking that perhaps if you loosen the screw that I have circled in yellow and adjust the piece (the whole winder) under the screw so that the opening is toward the hand wheel you might have better luck?
https://www.quiltingboard.com/attach...1&d=1580693966
and when the bobbin winder is in position for winding the bobbin the wheel will ride on the hub of the hand wheel, not in the n groove for the belt as shown be the right yellow arrow. The left arrow is the position it would be in for winding the bobbin if there was one there.
https://www.quiltingboard.com/attach...1&d=1580693977
I saw something the other day about putting what I call broccoli rubber bands over the bobbin winder tire.
Janey - Neat people never make the exciting discoveries I do.
Last edited by OurWorkbench; 02-02-2020 at 05:51 PM. Reason: clarify image usage.
02-03-2020, 05:46 AM
#7
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Thanks for the information Janey!
To clear up misconceptions from my earlier post and photo, I include better photos of the bobbin winder and roller below:
As you can see in the left photo, the mechanism is adjusted as far as it can go. All photos are of the winder pushed down (engaged) and should be ready to wind onto a bobbin (not present) and still there is a gap of 0.2 inches from the hand wheel to the roller (right photo)! As far as my research goes, the roller diameter is correct (1 1/8 inches) and the hand wheel is correct. This really baffles me and I'm starting to wonder if this was an early model 66 that used the bobbin winder you mentioned (that rolls on the leather belt) and my grandmother got rid of that at some point, installed this one, and realized it didn't work and wrapped the hand wheel with tape to take up the gap. However I notice in many photos that Model 66 uses this style of Bobbin winder and it seems to work for everyone!!!
To clear up misconceptions from my earlier post and photo, I include better photos of the bobbin winder and roller below:
As you can see in the left photo, the mechanism is adjusted as far as it can go. All photos are of the winder pushed down (engaged) and should be ready to wind onto a bobbin (not present) and still there is a gap of 0.2 inches from the hand wheel to the roller (right photo)! As far as my research goes, the roller diameter is correct (1 1/8 inches) and the hand wheel is correct. This really baffles me and I'm starting to wonder if this was an early model 66 that used the bobbin winder you mentioned (that rolls on the leather belt) and my grandmother got rid of that at some point, installed this one, and realized it didn't work and wrapped the hand wheel with tape to take up the gap. However I notice in many photos that Model 66 uses this style of Bobbin winder and it seems to work for everyone!!!
02-03-2020, 06:52 AM
#8
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Originally Posted by Hisownself
...All photos are of the winder pushed down (engaged) and should be ready to wind onto a bobbin (not present) and still there is a gap of 0.2 inches from the hand wheel to the roller (right photo)! ...
ETA: I looked closer at your new photo and mine. It looks like on yours the black painted comes straight down from the metal piece that needs to be adjusted, whereas, mine is at a slight angle. The adjusting screw is below the circled screw. If you need more info, let me know and will try to explain better or illustrate better.
Janey - Neat people never make the exciting discoveries I do.
Last edited by OurWorkbench; 02-03-2020 at 07:01 AM.
02-03-2020, 02:21 PM
#9
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Originally Posted by OurWorkbench
My suggestion would be to un-engage the winder, then unscrew the circled screw and push the mechanism to a different position. Tighten the screw and try to engage again.
ETA: I looked closer at your new photo and mine. It looks like on yours the black painted comes straight down from the metal piece that needs to be adjusted, whereas, mine is at a slight angle. The adjusting screw is below the circled screw. If you need more info, let me know and will try to explain better or illustrate better.
ETA: I looked closer at your new photo and mine. It looks like on yours the black painted comes straight down from the metal piece that needs to be adjusted, whereas, mine is at a slight angle. The adjusting screw is below the circled screw. If you need more info, let me know and will try to explain better or illustrate better.
Janey - Neat people never make the exciting discoveries I do.
02-04-2020, 04:21 AM
#10
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Janey, thanks for the photo of the winding mechanism! I was able to use it to carefully compare to the winder on my Singer. The pivot point and adjusting screw are further back on yours than on mine, and as a result the roller on yours is further back than mine. After more research online my suspicion is that the winder on mine is from a 1950's era Model 66 and not the original 1921 Model 66 version. I suspect the later versions moved the winder further forward to accommodate solid handwheels designed for electric motors. As luck would have it, there was a 1921 bobbin winder on ebay yesterday which i purchased to confirm my hypothesis! It looked to be in rough shape but I'm hoping it's just dirt and surface rust and will work after cleaning it up!
