what i did is i went on the internet and look at the quilters and than i printed out what the quilter had and the price, than i sat down and compared them. some i threw out becuase of the price . some i didnt like the frame. throat size was important to me . i ended up with a tin lizy 18 i was lucky and got a good deal when they stoping making them 18. plus i had also looked at some in shops to.