I remember when we went from old machines in home ec to the T&S I had to take all my sewing home to do - I spent way too much time messing with the stupid bobbin winder. I wouldn't touch a Singer after that until I found one in the garbage - I would have left it in the garbage but my sister dared me to make it work. I did and I'm glad. It was a Singer 401G - I learned a lot and have decided that pre-T&S Singer machines are just fine. After that - not so much.