We bought a used Voyager 17 and Hinterberg frame for !500.00 a few years ago and had nothing but trouble with it. Even DH could not figure out our problem and he is pretty good at fixing things. So we traded it in for a Nolting Fun 17 and did not have to trade in the frame. The Nolting people bought out Voyager and have some used Voyagers. There was just a world of difference between the 2 machines. I would strongly suggest you buy one where you can get lessons and a lot of tech support.