Cheating???
 

I was speaking to someone who won grand prize at the county fair for her quilt. It was beautiful. But after talking to her she said she sent it out to be sandwiched quilted and binded. Is that not cheating? Or is that ok?

I saw your post and had to do some research - I had no idea that quilts could be entered in shows that weren't all your own work! :shock:

Now I'm confused. Is it the piecer or the actual quilter that wins and how is it judged?

Does it make a difference then, if someone can afford to pay a LAQ for an intricate, expensive pattern and someone has a simpler pattern they've done themselves?

I'll be watching this post.

many entries even in big quilt shows are created (pieced) by one person and quilted by another---it is not 'cheating' it is fairly common practice---lots of people (even award winning ones) do not quilt their own quilts.
it is also common practice (and kind of expected) for the quilt owner to give credit where due...and acknowledge /include the quilters name on their label and on their entry information...I often when visiting shows see beautiful quilts that say- 'quilt by_____________; quilted by;_____________
I've even seen a few of the quilts i've quilted for others entered...unless the catagory it is entered in clearly states it has to be all your own work....but i've been to lots of shows and have entered lots....and have not seen that distinction...even hand quilted quilts are at times quilted by someone other than the person who pieced the top. i know ladies who hand quilt for others and do beautiful work worth 'showing' !

I thought if someone else had quilted the quilt it was a 2 person quilt and both names or just a comment if paid, quilted by had to be on label.

In our quilt show, any such 'assists' change the category of the quilt and must be stated. what are the rules in your show? while it is possible this is an honest error, I doubt it.

It depends on the show/fair.
You really need to see the class specifics.

I have entered at several fairs now and believe me, it's a nightmare to read and interpret all the "rules", and not just for the who made it part!!!!

Some are very specific that the entrant must have done ALL the work.
Some allow you to enter if you pieced, and someone else quilted, and you must state their name.
Some have classes for one ... and separate classes for the other.
Sometimes only the piecing is judged.
Sometimes only the quilting is judged.
Some have them merged and/or in all sorts of combinations.
Some will only award the Grand Champion to a quilt made solely by one person.
Some will award the Grand to any quilt that has met it's class specifics.

And one Fair (with deluxe prize moneys), had taken a different approach to recognize phenomenal quilts ... you don't even have to put one stitch in the quilt. In your entry, you acknowledge who pieced it, quilted it, the original pattern designer, and the current owner.

So it really is all over the map on this ... and sometimes when you are at the show/fair the class specifications are not noted for the spectators to know the difference.

It is a common practice. Check out the rules for that show\fair. Read them carefully.

Please don't use the word "cheat". Someone told me I was a CHEATER...loudly and often, because I'm a machine quilter and not a hand quilter. Its SUCH a strong word. I was so upset, I cried. Now I'm just angry that I let that man's words cheapen the nice work I do. Everyone has their own opinions I know, but this is QUILTING..not surgery or rocket science. There is a place for ALL that we do. By the way, next time I show off a quilt, and his JAW drops, he might hear that he will NEVER get one of my quilts. And I did not picket his cabinet shop with signs that said he was a cheater because he uses POWER TOOLS instead of hand tools. ....ok...sorry! Off my soap box now...I love it ALL..hand, machine, quilt for hire, do all your own... we need to back ourselves up, not knock ourselves down.

Way to go, glad you got that off your chest. Even though I much prefer HQ'ng, cause I love the feel, the look, and the relaxation, MQ'ng to me is an 'art' on quilting. Not that it's not quilting, it just doesn't have the same feel when there's so much thread on it. I do feel though if there is a need there is a way. Don't let anyone ever condom you for your gift of sewing or how you interrupt an "art," they are both Art, HQ and FMQ. They are the same but different. Next time someone says you're Cheating, tell them, Well, so is a Debit Card.

This hits a nerve also. What about all those quilts that were tied? Did they cheat? I never machine quilted until after I retired. I will never be a hand quilter for the simple reasons that 1: I want to finish a quilt, and 2: it would hurt my hands too much. But, I do admire the beautiful hand quilted quilts and all the hours spent on it.

When I was a kid, we "tied" the quilts.

Beth, I bet you wished you had thought of the power tools come back when that guy said that to you. I just told my DH about your post. He agreed with you about the power tools.

Also, our ancestors used what was available. If they had a sewing machine, they used it. If they would have had access to rotary cutters, they would have used them too.

I also never heard of binding a quilt until after I retired. When did binding become popular? We used to just hem quilts.

I imagine every quilt show has their rules. I have been to them and read the cards that tell who pieced them and who quilted them. Sometimes it was the same person but most of the time it was different people. The quilts were beautiful no matter who quilted them.

I think of quilting as an art and art is seldom perfect. It also falls into the category that beauty is in the eyes of the beholder.

Even though I just wrote all that, I'm still my worse critic - but no one else had better criticize my work! Them's "fighten" words! LOL

In this area you can enter your quilt but you have to show on your entry label that is was pieced by ........ and quilted by.......... I see that a lot and it is nice that credit is given to the deserving person.

Most county fairs have relaxed rules for entries. If they were too rigid there would be nothing entered. I am in charge of the quilts at our local fair. The categories are hand quilted, hand pieced. Hand pieced, machine quilted. Machine pieced, hand quilted. A tied quilt is considered hand quilted, they never win top prize though. A winner is selected from each category by size within that category. Multiple names can be on one entry, the judges never see the entry sheet though.

Wow, a lot of information. I love to look at quilts, I don't care who did what, they all look like works of art to me. If I were a "judge" maybe I would look at them differently. But I am just too happy to see "what I think is pure magic" happening with material and thread (no matter how people choose to do it).

At our fair there are different categories, such as Hand Quilted, machine quilted, pieced by one person and quilted by another, etc. As stated before, credit should be given for who did what.

No it is not cheating. You can win having the top quilted by someone else but like everyone said each show has its own rules but in my opinion all credits should go to the people invloved. I will never show a quilt that has been long arm quilted by someone else without giving that person full credit...it is just not right.

Being that you are the in-charge person at your Fair, then it's time to have a new class for those Hand Tied Quilts to compete with each other. Every Fair here has at least one tied class ... sometimes more, allowing for different sizes or types of quilts. Another class that I like to see is "at least 50 different fabrics". The frustration comes when I have to decide which class for a quilt to be entered into! :D (aside from interpreting the "rules"!:))

I don't make the entry rules. The State Fair board does that and the county and district fairs follow those rules. I make sure all the quilts are entered in the right category, all the paperwork is filled out, each entry gets a number, the quilts are kept clean and displayed properly, the judges are not kept waiting and keep records or which quilt wins what ribbon. It's all volunteer work.

Here's my 2 cents. I love to look at the quilts at a show and just admire. If there's something that speaks to me, I'd like to know who to ask-so giving credit is important. Some people look at shows to find a LAQ that can quilt a style compatible to their piecing and style. I would like to know how the classes were determined: a list posted somewhere conspicuous would be nice-maybe in the show brochere. And I'd like to know which class each quilt is in: maybe on the description at each quilt.

I think professional quilting shouldn't compete with amateur quilting. So if it's professionally quilted I think it should be entered in a professional catagory.

As to "cheating", if they follow the rules of that show, it's not cheating.

I've never been to a show or fair where professionally quilted quilts are entered in the same category as amateur quilted quilts. I am the Superintendent for the fair in my county. There's a whole section for professionally quilted quilts and we're going to expand that section this year.

The tag on the quilt has the section number and the class number. To find out what those numbers mean you just need a fair booklet that's available at several places in town.

So was my great grandmother cheating when she used a sewing machine to piece a log cabin quilt in the late 1800's?That quilt is now displayed on the back on my couch.

At our shows, we always ask on the form #1, Owner, #2, the quilter (or the one who constructed the quilt and #3, the name of the quilter. It is very common for the one who pieced the quilt and the quilter to be different. No cheating IMHO.

All the shows in my area have categories for "quilting done by others"...I machine piece and have the quilting done by a professional long arm quilter. I was having to pay for a binding to be applied but am trying machine binding for quilts that are made as gifts and that is working out well....my "practice" is on baby quilts where the machine applied binding is preferred to withstand rugged use. You see....I cannot hold a needle. I can barely pick up pins.
I got a blue ribbon at our state fair a couple of years ago for my most prized quilt. It was entered in "quilting done by others" category.
Most of the women in my quilt group that love hand quilting are our very senior seniors and one by one they are less able to do the quilting. Our younger members all prefer to use a long arm quilter. I have seen a huge shift in this in the past 5 years. The shows are even creating sub-categories in the "quilting done by others" group because of the number of entries not hand quilted.
I would take great offense to "cheating" as a description, just as soccertxi did. It's a different form, but not cheating. That, to me, is like saying acrylic paintings are cheating since they are not oil.

I enter my quilts in a Quilt show every year. Some are hand pieced and some are machine pieced,some have been appliqued and a few have had embroidery. I always send them out to be quilted. You have to acknowledge the quilter. They are judged on pattern, color, piecing, binding, the quilting, and if they are even squared up. If you enter as a beginner, and win, the next year you have to enter as intermediant and so on. I always give credit to the one who quilted them. I have won 6 times, and do not consider myself a cheater.

Not sure if its cheating, but its definatly unfair.Unfair to the person who did the quilting, and unfair to everyone else by giving the impression it was a single person quilt. Give credit where credit is due!

I think that initially when I heard that some people entered shows with quilts that others quilted, I also thought like the OP...but then I realized that you are supposed to give credit to the one who actually quilted the quilt if it was a different person than the piecer. So, if that is the case, then both are given credit and that seems fair enough.

The only reason it seems wrong to many is that if the judging is the "quilting" primarily (as opposed to the piecing of the top), then it seems like the wrong person is getting the ribbon. However, it appears like the judges have figured it all out and seem to cover all the bases, making sure everyone gets the credit they deserve.

All I have to say is that I use my own patterns, I piece it myself, quilt it and bind it myself. If I win, it is all me and my effort. I do not think it is fair to have my quilts judged in the same category as professionally quilted ones, but hey that will make me work harder and eventually put me on the same level, if not higher with those professional quilters. Give credit where credit is due, and if you are like me, accept the challenge and be the best you can be.
Not to open another can of worms, but computer guided quilting is really raising the bar. Can I ever be that good to compete against the quilting software.

I know that our local county fair has a category for professional machine quilted entries....so depending on the category she entered it it I would hesitate to call it cheating.

No she wasn't cheating!! She was at the forefront of technology for her time!

IMHO If you are going to enter your quilt in a show or compitition then be sure you read the rules very closely. If you do not like the rules then do not enter your quilt! Also do not questions the rules and do not make claims of "cheating " if you do not know the rules of the compitition!!!

The quilting is not the only thing that's judged. Everything from how well the fabrics go together to construction to overall impact is judged. Judges have a whole list of things they go thru for each and every quilt. Each quilt is judged on its own merits then judged against the other top contenders in the same class and then against the top contenders for that section. Then all top section winners are judged against each other for the top ribbons. The judging process is fairly long.

Our fair even has an antique category and you only have to own the quilt to enter it!

To decide someone is cheating based on just wandering thru a quilt show or fair does a real disservice to the quilter, the judges and the show organizers.

I know some who have their quilts quilted by others, believe if they pay the quilter for their work it is their quilting. I do not agree with this, since the quilter spent time making their piece a quilt, and the maker only sewed the pieces together to make a top. I also do not agree with quilters name on quilts in a show. The person who owns the quilt and pays for the quilt to be finished, then is advertising for the quilter. Most quilters do not give a person a break on the price if they do give them the credit. I guess it is a complete circle. And will always be a question.

AMEN soccertxi, I totally agree with you. Thingfs change, it is ok if someone wants to do things by hand or the old way but these are new times and most things are done the easier way. I hate it when some people are so critical and like to put down other people and what they do. Keep doing what you love and just give Him a piece of your mind the next time. I would let Hi8m know that He would never get one of your Quilts and I would also ask Him why He don't do all His work without power tools, it is the same!!! Have a wonderful Easter and keep Quilting the way you love to. :)

I put the machine quilter's name and state and date on the label along with my own piecing and applique. Before I send it out.

I have known a few people who enter shows without indicating the quilting or patchwork is done by someone else. They have to live with it, not me.

Many many well known quilt book authors send their tops out to be quilted and very seldom is it mentioned in the book. Both hand and machine.

At our local show whoever makes the top gets the credit and the ribbon and the long armer isn't even mentioned usually. I've been to other shows where there were two ribbons, one for the piecer and one for the long armer. I will say that two years ago most of the quilts were quilted by someone other than the piecer but this year I saw quite a few quilts that were completely done by one person, several hand quilted. Maybe pride of workmanship is coming back rather than just quantity of quilts or more people are getting their own long arm setups.

I entered a hand embroideried ABC quilt I had made for my grandson. I machine quilted it and entered it in our little county fair where it won a 2nd place ribbon. I was proud of it and my grandson loved the fact that his quilt won. I was sharing the news with my neighbor and she made the statement that it was just a little ole county fair and didn't mean much in the quilt world! After I got over her rudeness I told her it meant a lot in my world...and Billy's!

It all depends on the rules for the specific event. Hopefully they were within the guidelines

Perhaps it was considered a " group " quilt, and/or you just don't know the specifics of what the entry form said. Let it go!

At the quilt shows in my area the name of the person who pieced it and the person who quilted it are are both on the label.