Trade for quilting
 

So, I have a friend who is a personal trainer and we are considering a trade. I would sew/quilt for her and recieve her personal training services in return.

We haven't discussed pricing yet, but that is something that will be worked out b-4 we get started. What I'm trying to figure out is what to tell her for my pricing.

I'm really thinking it'd be best for her to buy the materials so she can pick out what she likes and so I don't have to worry about that end of things. So aside from materials how do I figure out what to charge for labor? I have a LA, so I would just charge her what I would charge any customer for the quilting, but for piecing and binding how do I work that out? I know the standard answer is just keep track of time and multiply it by an hourly rate, but what kind of hourly rate should I charge?

She will likewise charge me her hourly rate, I don't know what it is, but assuming it's $25/hr (to make the math easy) if I charge $10/hr for piecing/binding plus my rate for quilting it could very well be over $200 (I know this is a low guess, but I'm just guessing here) for the labor on a quilt which would equal 8 hours of personal training.

Any ideas on how a person would feel about trading 8 hours (or more) of personal training for a quilt (on the personal trainer's side)?

I don't think she'd have a problem with that, but we're not really close friends, so I can't be sure.
I like to barter, but I don't want anyone to feel they are getting the raw end of the deal.

Thanks in advance for any input.

Don't under estimate what your time is worth. When I was working my hourly rate was over $20.00 an hour - why would it be any less now that I'm sewing. Just let her know it could take X number of hours to cut fabric, X number of hours to sew, X number of hours to layer and baste, X number of hours to quilt, X number of hours to bind. Then she can decide if she wants to "pay" that much for a quilt. Good luck

I wuld not do it as you are dealing with apples and oranges. It is difficult to compare the vaue of the two. She has a set price and probably doesn't understand the value of your work. This sounds like a disaster in the making with a lot of frustration. I wouldn't trade 8 hours of personal training for a quilt for anyone.

Great ideas from Nammie to 7. I would involve her in your process of determining price. She may want to involve you in how she determines her price.

Why not just keep track of your labor hours and trade hour for hour? Why would your time be worth any less than hers?

I think it is a cool idea. I would go for 8-10 hours of personal training. How complicated is the pattern?

I once was asked thru a friend "to make a tote bag for a gal that saw my bags...she would give me a massage as payment as she had the print fabric and could do it her self, but was much too busy to do it her self". My friend gave me her number and you may have guessed. . . I never contact her. Just my opinion on trades.

Judy in Phx, AZ

One hour of massage labor for a bag which takes several hours of labor??? Was she kidding? :eek:

Jan in VA

Make it a business deal and not one of friendship and get it in writing or the trade will never be a fair one. I know from experience how trainers work. Schedules change and once they think you know what you are doing you don't need them and they pick up new clients and because you are not paying cash your importance goes to the bottom of the list. That is just the way it is. For trainers time is money. I know this because I've been there.

I've seen lots of friendships ruined over such deals. She is not a close friend so your importance may be less than required for such a trade. Sorry to be so harsh but experience is a the greatest teacher.

Your base price for a quilt should start at 400.00 bucks. Don't underestimate your worth.

Or I could be totally wrong.
peace

My longarmer and I have successfully bartered services (my computer services for her longarming a show quilt), but we are very good friends and, because we are both quilters and both computer geeks, we each knew when the balance had been reached. No rates were ever mentioned, nothing was written down, and we are still very good friends. :)

Your situation is very different. If you go the "rate" route, you should come up with an honest hourly rate that covers everything, materials excluded, for a custom quilt, start to finish. You shouldn't have to break it down or explain how you came up with it, and you certainly shouldn't involve her in determining the rate. It's the rate for your work and you do not have to justify it any more than the trainer has to justify her rate to you. It shouldn't be any more negotiable than your plumber's rate. Materials would be a separate expense and she can decide whether she wants to purchase them or reimburse you for doing so (time and cost).

If you go the "time" route, the trainer will likely decline, for surely it takes you longer to make a quilt, especially if you have to shop for the materials, than she would be willing to match in lost training revenue (if she's training you for free, she's not training someone else for pay). Average personal trainer fees are in the $30-$60/hour range at a chain gym, $50-$100/hour if private, so, in reality, her time probably would be worth more than yours.

Be very, very careful. There's not much worse than a barter arrangement gone sour.

I wouldn't do it. Sometimes quilters can be unreal pricing their quilts. I make quilts for my own pleasure. I give most of them away. My choice all around.

My gut reaction after reading this is, don't. Trading is my least favorite way of bargaining. I had a policy not to trade in the antique business. On the rare occasion I did trade, I was sorely disappointed.

I don't see why you can't make a trade with her. I think she will owe you a few more hours than what you'll owe her. My DMIL does taxes and barters with plumbers, painters, carpet layers, etc. It works out well for all involved. I think it's a nifty thing to do.
She wants a quilt and you want personal training. I paid $25 an hour for personal training where I live. I would have swapped for a quilt in a heartbeat. I think it's a great idea! Go for it!!!

I agree with Holice.

Well an agreement will be met before any trading actually takes place. But I have traded knitting for hair coloring/cut before and was quite happy about it. This is a girl I've known for 22 years and she is an amazing trainer! I don't have money to pay a trainer, but I do have time to quilt. Thank you for the concerns raised and advise given though. I think you are right it'll probably come out to more than 8 hours. She just wants a couple crib quilts though, and that is my favorite size! :-) I think we can make this work.

I agree with Holice too but that's just me :)

I say go for it!!! :) .. You are both getting something that you want!

Jan,
Guess she did not think it thru, but sure glad I did. Lol. :)

Judy

I'm doing a swap right now with my LA'er. She's giving me $1.00 credit for every 9-patch, from a set of fabric. Neither one of us realized what we were getting into. It's going to be around $200.00. I talked to her yesterday and she was flabbergasted. Apparently she liked this method so much that she has farmed out about 12 quilts. And no money coming in.

I told her not to worry about mine. I'd hold off for a couple of months and give her some time to recover. They just moved into a new (to them) farm house and had to have all of the windows redone before autumn. Plus her husband (a county Sherrif) gets a month vacation, so they take the entire month of July and go Alaska so he and her boys can hunt and fish, and lay in as much meat as they can for the coming year.

So there is a month with no LA'ing.

She is a good friend, so I trust her absolutely.

If you trust this woman, and she buys all the supplies, I say go for it, if you can set a price that you can both be happy with.

I wish I could get a personal trainer for $25/hour. Mine is $70/hr and that is if I pay for 10 upfront - otherwise it's more.
No under estimate your pricing.

That would be a difficult one to figure, but don't sell yourself and your work short!!!

I can see the pros and cons. I think if the two of you can come to an agreement that makes you both happy, it should work out to everyone's satisfaction. I like the idea of bartering but would need to have everything outlined and agreed on at the onset.

If you are doing a trade and she charges you $25 an hour then charge her $25 an hour.

Exactly. Give her an estimate of how many hours you think it'll take to complete and then see if she's willing to give that much of her time.

I like the "hour for hour" with her buying the supplies. Your time is as valuable as hers!

Just to let you know, some personal trainers get from $52.00 and hour. This is what a trained personal trained gets at the YMCA. Check the prices this personal trainer gets where she works then go from there. Good luck!!!

Why would a person trainer's time be worth $25 and hour and yours only $10? If you want that deal, that's up to you, but don't give yourself the sort end of the stick,and under value yourself. You don't have to look far on this board to find quilters who have made quilts for far less than they should have because they feel like they are charging too much, and regret having agreed to the project. In the end, it's your decision, but if you decide your time and skills are worth a decent going rate - at least as much as the personal trainer- you will have a whole lots of quilters who will back you up!!

Find out what she charges first. Then don't forget all the money you will have invested in supplies, labor, and if you purchase the fabric on line and have to have it shipped. When you decide on a design that she likes (as she will have to have a plan for your training) (time on cardio, weights, eating plan etc.) you have to work on the pattern and size. Since you're not really friends, she is in the "BUSINESS OF PERSONAL TRAINING" and "BUSINESS IS BUSINESS". I saw the other day where a queen size quilt was priced at $400.00 on one of the websites. Call some of the LQS and ask what they charge. Tell them your situation. Also depends on the size of the quilt. I know a gal who charges $200.00 for a twin, $300=full=400=queen and up. it also depends on how many different colors of material you're going to use. Going to do a whole cloth, scrappy, 2 designs or more. Then you have batting and backing and sashing(?). DO NOT SELL YOURSELF SHORT!

I have a very good friend and I do her hair for free. I make her handbags for free, she does things for me, but I always pay her, I feel like I am getting the raw end of the friendship...I don't know how to change it...

My advice is becareful ...

I totaly agree. To cut,make,baste,quilt and bind a quilt for 8 hours of training is not worth it.

Don't do it unless you are willing to loose her as a friend. It is easy for you both to see how many hours are spent in personal training, but it will be hard for her to understand how many hours it takes to make a quilt.

I think that if you both feel that you are getting a deal, then you are. If you can't afford personal training, but have the time to work on a quilt then it doesn't matter. Only thing I would be wary of is the difficulty of the quilt itself. That can make a huge difference in time. I make quilts just for fun without anyone paying me a nickel, so for me that would work out great

You truly need to speak up and talk with her. If she is a true friend she will understand. If she is not willing to listen then she is just an user and you can send her down the road!

Don't do it...........Don't do it..............Don't do it She would be severely using you!!

If I were in your shoes, she would purchase the pattern and fabrics for top and backing etc..I would estimate my time to make the quilt and I would charge in the $15 -$25 per hour range depending on the complexity of design. Regarding the longarm quilting if she wants the quilt custom quilted then I would charge whatever your rate would be depending on complexity of quilting. I have no idea what a personal trainer charges per month but I would expect to barter weeks/month(s) of personal training of an equal value for your work to produce what she wants from you. And I agree DO NOT under estimate the value the skill that you bring to the table.

Oh and also..I would have a "contract" agreement written up that clearly states the terms prior to you starting working on her quilt..it should be a legal document that would stand up in a court of law. I hope you know this person very very well. I think I would work on her quilt and also use up some bartered personal training along the way..

Good luck! It could out where you are both very happy or both very sad. Time is money, whether it is hers or yours.
I myself wouldn't do it because I am too independent. I want to work on what I chose when I chose to do it. Otherwise it would seem like a job to me.

If the two of you can agree to what each considers an equitable trade, then I say go for it. If either is likely to end up feeling like having gotten the raw end of the deal, then forget it.

When you say "sew/quilt" is there a chance that she's thinking of some sewing in addition to those crib quilts? Go with caution, especially if she picks the fabrics. One of my friends years ago agreed to make a skirt for another friend of hers, thinking: "How hard can that be?" and the woman picked a sheer, slippery fabric that frayed like crazy and had to be lined. It was extremely difficult to work with. She had to buy a special foot for her machine, and a straight stitch needle plate. The fact that her friend bought the fabric made it all the more difficult because she was afraid of ruining it. Even if it's fabric only for quilting, you should go along for the shopping because your friend may not know the difference between one fabric and another. Good luck!

You do her hair for free AND make bags for her for free, yet when she does things you pay her? If you feel like you're getting the raw end of the deal - you ARE! My inclination would be to stop paying her for whatever it is she does for you. And if she complains, at least you know where you stand in the "friendship" and can decide whether her company is worth feeling used, or if you would be happier finding a less demanding friend. Good luck!