Wonky tops!
 

I have a (new to me) HQ 16 and a few friends have asked me to quilt their tops..problem is their wonky tops, with wavy borders. I am just using a loose meander and try to make it as straight as I can but sometimes I get folds/gathers in the borders and middle of the quilt .:(

I feel bad but what can I do?? Should I tell them the correct way to make a border by measuring thru the middle...or would they feel offended.

If you don't tell them they will never learn -- I guess that is why I would never consider doing quilts for others! But tht is just me.

personally I tell them and teach them are I don't do them.

I would tell them and offer to help/give advice in how to correct the quilt rather than have it wind up with folds or pleats. Of course you know your friends much better than we do, and there may be some that might be offended, so tread carefully. Maybe point out the wavy border and say you may have trouble quilting it, and would they like to know how you have fixed that problem in your own quilts in the past?

The long arm quilters that I know have brochures on how to apply borders so they are not wavy. One quilter I worked with would examine the top as it was brought in. If the border was wavy she nicely offered the customer 2 choices, either take it back and fix it or she would fix it for an additional fee. Sounds harsh, but she never lacked customers.

Thanks for you advice, I will tread lightly, but will use it as a teaching moment..when I explain why there were these flaws.

My quilter told me because I honestly didn't know better. Glad she did.

A picture is worth a thousand words. If you can show them the problem, all the better.

If I were you, I'd also make up a paper to give your customers which outlines steps they should take to prepare the quilt top for longarm quilting. Include : top and backing all need to be square, all loose threads on back of quilt top need to be trimmed, etc. It's amazing how many good piecers will come with a lovely top which is just not square. I guess they just don't bother to check for that and measure it in several places once it's finished. And it's important for you to know if it's out of square, and how much, before you tackle it.

for you long armers- Why does it have to be squared up? i understand the wavy borders but what difference does it make if one bottom corner is off by an inch or so? .. Just curious..

IMHO Id tread lightly and ask if they would like a suggestion on a way to fix as its difficult to LA wavy borders..

The quilt sandwich is loaded on a rack that is perfectly square (if it wasn't the carriage that the machine rides on would never glide smoothly). If the quilt is out of square (and an inch or so is a LOT out of square) it won't load on the rack correctly and lay nice and flat in the exposed quilting area.

With most racks the quilt back is loaded with one end of the backing on what is called "take up roller" which will be taking up the completed quilt sandwich as the quilt is quilted and advanced on the frame. The bottom of the backing is rolled up on a different roller located at the front of the frame. One of the quilt top's edges is loaded on another roller (unless it is floated) also at the front of the machine and rolled up as well. At any given time, depending on the size of the LAQ's machine, only about 16" to 22" of the quilt is exposed for quilting.

The LAQ lines up the top, batting and backing and stitches a line of quilting across the top to secure the sandwich together and attaches side tension clamps. Then we proceed with quilting. If the quilt is out of square in one corner even just an inch or two this problem gets amplified as the quilt is quilted and advanced. It is a lot of extra work to try and quilt and avoid the problems of an out of square quilt (which in my experience is ALWAYS accompanied by a wavy border or fullness in the middle). It can result in pleats, puckers or very exaggerated out of square quilt by the time the last lines of quilting are put in. Sometimes this isn't an issue for the person who pieced it sometimes it is and they tend to blame the LAQ for the problem.

I would tell them so they don't blame you for the finished product they may be disappointed in. Just tell them. They may be depending on you to correct the problem as you go. Everyone wants tips to help them with improving the out come of their quilts.

So is that only a problem with Panto's - as they wont be straight?( IM not a LA.. I want one, hence the picking of brains from experience LA's . )

If they float and are all over freehand meandering does it still create havoc? again just wondering..

IMHO the best way to learn how to make a quilt suitable for giving to a professional LAQer is to learn to DIY from start to finish. If I screwed anything up then I will surely learn what made it difficult to quilt on a DSM, and then try to remember not to do it the next quilt.

I've been quilting for just three years and never sent a thing to get LAQ'ed. Still not satisfied I've got a product could stand up to the treatment. Plus, I know where the difficult spots are - where seams in a block join in a nightmare cluster despite best efforts, or where rows joined up with difficulty in spots, or one mitered corner is a bit shaky, etc. - and I quilt around them. (If you LAQers can deal with all that fussy stuff, shout out and correct me :) )

Out of square will be an issue with any long armed quilt, although some designs will be more of an issue than others. In addition to the great info Feline Fanatic provided, quilters will also take measurements side to side as the quilt it advanced, like along a line of sashing or an obvious seam where blocks meet. You can scoot the quilt a bit, but it gets more difficult as you go. Usually it's not just the border that's out of whack, it's the whole quilt. Some issues can be addressed with custom quilting, but many folks don't want to pay for that. That's why it's important for the LA quilter to look over the top, with the piecer, when it's dropped off. They can note any issues with the top before accepting and provide a realistic expectation of the results. When I got my long arm, I worked with a couple other quilters in the area to see if I wanted to quilt for hire. Issues like this were one of the reasons I decided to only quilt for family and friends. I can tell them to go fix it!

Feline and Paper Princess, that was great help in understanding what goes on. I'm awed and floored that someone could consider a quilt to be done and be an inch or more out of square - for that to happen, something has to be wrong in joining the rows.

The woman who does mine (she owns the shop) has done some pretty wonky tops before and I'm sure mine aren't perfect, I think she just does the best she can with what she's got, but then again she's been doing it for 20 years or longer. She always makes mine look fantastic and she sews the binding on for me.

Joining rows, joining pieces into blocks etc. Consider 1/4" seam allowance being off a mere 1/16th of an inch but multiply that by many pieces in the quilt. It can be fixed along the way. If the blocks are squared up during assembly a fraction of an inch "easing" is fine and can be inconsequential to loading on a LA rack and quilting. Even the whole top can be off if it is squared up with the final borders it is amazing how much a difference that will make. Just taking that final step of putting the borders on by measuring center of quilt first, then cutting your border to the center measurement of the quilt then easing in the small variances that our bound to happen during construction (fabric distorts, it is the nature of the beast) while attaching the border (yes that means using the dreaded PIN) makes all the difference in the world.

A lot of issues, the LAQ can work around, ease in, manipulate while quilting. We steam, we spray, we pin and starch the smooth with one hand while guiding the machine with the other to try and avoid complications (only when working from front, can't do any of this when doing pantos from the back). For many of us it is our art and we want to do the best we can for every quilt and make it pretty as possible. We want our clients to be happy, really!

Many people just cut the border strips, WOF (which also distorts because it has stretch), sew several together until they have more than enough, sew them to the edges of the quilt then lop them off when at the corner with their ruler, assuming it is straight and square. I have had quilts come to me that measure 2 or more inches more on the right side than on the left side and same top to bottom. If the quilt was set on point with setting triangles cut so the bias edge is on the edge before attaching that final border it can be much, much worse. One quilt I got was so bad out of square, I had to remove the outer borders, measure and recut them. One of them I cut 6" off the length! SIX! I couldn't believe it myself. But this quilt was for a long distance friend and I did it because she was a friend. I explained the problem but I don't know if she got it or not. I think quilting was a passing passion for her and she burnt herself out. Thankfully the majority of quilts that cross my rack are true and square and load with no problems and quilt up just beautifully. In fact, my only problem quilts all came from this one friend who jumped in with both feet and churned them out like her life depended on it.

For the OP, this would be the perfect teaching opportunity for your friends if they want to continue quilting, if they are like mine who only seemed to have the passion as a passing fancy then I wouldn't bother. Have them see for themselves the difference in measurement and explain what will happen in quilting with the wonkiness (pleats and puckers) and how they can keep that from happening in the future. Of course it would have to be done prior to quilting.

If you don't discuss the issue of the wonkiness, you both will be dissappointed. Gentle honest is always the best policy. Think of it as a teaching moment.

When you discover that the quilt is wonky, you could call the owner and tell her that she can take it back and fix it, or she can get a quilt quilted with puckers, folds, tucks. Or she can take it to a "professional" who has more experience dealing with wonky quilts.

This is a very interesting and informational thread! I learned a lot from this. Can someone tell me what IMHO means? Thank you

IMHO = In My Humble Opinion

Are your friends paying you to quilt their quilts? If so, you need to tell them exactly what you need them to do to make your job easier. I had one LAQ refuse to quilt my top because I hadn't pressed all the seams open. Of course, she didn't tell me this was required when we were discussing it. If she had, I would have told her I'd find someone else (I have worked with two other LAQers who never required this). If you are quilting them out of friendship, you need to have them help you load the quilts on the machine. That way, they will see the problems up close and personal, and you can discuss what problems you will encounter as you do the quilting. Make it a teachable moment.

Well, as long as we are at it, here's one of my favorite YouTube Videos "You can quilt that out"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XzoL7ddTEnA

it's hysterical (and true)

OMG LMAO!! That was great! Thanks for sharing PP.

You already have a great detailed answer to this question. Here's the short version: You expect to get back from your longarmer a nicely squared quilt, with no pleats and toe-catching puckers, right? Then isn't it logical that she needs to start with a squared quilt to begin with? We longarmers work very hard to give each customer the very best result. The best way to insure that's what you get is to give us a top without problems to begin with.

OH GOSH NO !! If its wonky to begin with im expecting to to be wonky when it returns.. NONE of my quilts are show quilts.. NONE of my quilts are perfect.. Im not a perfectionist so if my quilt is off a bit I personally dont care.. I know ive sent quite a few to LA's just because i want a 'different' design than what i can do.. Never have they said anything i HAD to fix.. All i asked is to have fun and surprise me. Ive been disappointed with one LA on this QB as the threads were coming apart at the beginning and ends of where they quilted.. they re-quilted it but even then never was i told i HAD to fix the wonkyness..

What a stitch! Oh, I meant, what a hoot!

Thank you for this. I'm about to take my first quilt top to have it quilted. I've always made tops that I could quilt on my Bernina and am a fairly new sewer, 4 years. This top is a king so there isn't any way I can do this myself. I now know what to look for before taking it to the quilter. Yes, tell your customers what you expect from them so you can give them a beautiful quilting job. If you return their quilts less perfect then they expect you know who they will blame, because they don't know it was their work that was the problem. I'm sure it would also take the fun out of quilting for you also and if it's not fun and profitable why do it.

Happy quilting!
Mia

Ask them if they square up their blocks before they assemble the quilt top. Also, don't add borders without checking your quilt top is square. Squaring up quilt blocks is essential.

Annette

Cute YouTube video! My feeling is this...You should try to go to all of the effort that you can to deliver a "perfect quilt" to the LAQ. Measure, square up, etc. But let's face it, NOBODY quilts a "perfect quilt." NOBODY! A LAQ should have a bit of tact and gentleness when letting someone know that their quilt is wonky and if it's minor, then just let it be and deal with it as best that you can. If it's majorly flawed, then kindly help by showing the piecer how to fix it properly, so that you can quilt it for him/her to look its best.

Afterall, it is a hand made item and not a cheapo-made quilt done in some foreign country on machines. It's going to have some flaws and character.

I love the idea of giving a handout on what the LA expects before you take it in. I hate having to guess or have to call or visit her to get the info.

Absolutely tell them! Explain that the tensions on a long arm machine REQUIRE that the quilt and borders need to be flat and square , and if they are not, the results will not be as nice a they would want. So many times, folks think you can"quilt it out", but trying to put a wonky quilt on a frame just make it worse.

My daughter, a long armer, usually informs the customer of the problem with the edge and tells them how to solve the problem. No long armer wants to send out a product that it not professional.

That is why I got out of the quilting for others business. I would call the customers and they would tell me to do what I could so they accepted the pleats and gathers but it was a real pain.

Just love the video. Thanks Good One!

I didn't understand the need to be so "squared up" and often just stuck my borders on after doing a good job squaring up blocks and other parts, until I started LAQing. Wow! After spending so much time with the piecing, doesn't everyone want a nice, flat, pucker-free finished quilt? One other thing to think about--make sure if you provide the backing to the LAQ, that you have cut it square--part of the reason that the LAQ asks for extra backing/batting(besides the quilting process and pinning to the frame leaders)to to provide enough backing if they need to square it up and still have enough fabric!

Wonky Quilts
 

Make sure when smoothing the quilt on the frame, to keep your hand movements horizontal from the middle of the quilt to the Left/right side. You may find yourself smoothing in a diagonal direction, and actually pulling the sides of the quilt down.

Another thing. if the borders are wavy...pin and then secure the sides first as you roll the quilt. smooth, from the inside out, working in any fullness in the borders and securing the ends. Now, when doing your meander...work from the outside in..using a slightly smaller meander (not so much that it's obvious) on the borders, and increasing the size slightly in the middle of the quilt.

When I have a quilt with borders...and I know they are waving...and I have a seam somewhere in the border, that is where I make a tuck, if I have to. I secure the sides of the quilt...and then Stitch in the ditch on the seams seperating the border from the inside of the quilt top...and use a piano key type design for the border...lines about 2" apart. For the corners of the borders...I do a diagonal line from inside the border to the very edge...I put my piano key lines right to the mitered line. You can stop at the very end of the border section (usually a seam there where the side meets the top or bottom border, then put a design in the corner that is left open. If there is extra fullness still...go back with each roll and do a small meander in every other piano key section.
If you look on Youtube for Jamie Wallen, you will find some great helps.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=756YpBu-xuk

The above link will take you to Jamie's tutorial on piano key borders. I really like his corner treatment.

Marge

Another thing you can do. If you have quilt magazines you don't use any more...find one with a tutorial on how to do the borders, or whatever is wrong with the customer's quilt. Gift them the magazine...."I am finished with this magazine, it's got lots of good helps for doing borders (flying geese, half square tris, etc.)." I do this with mailed in quilt tops and now with those coming into the shop...just subtle hints. Also, if I have the customer in front of me...I'll show what I had to do to make the borders fit...and then if they ask how to avoid the fullness...I will explain the process to them (and lately I give out how to sheets). Free lesson for them, less headaches (we hope) for us on the next quilt.
Marge