Review sit downs: George and Sweet 16
02-12-2021, 10:07 AM
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Review sit downs: George and Sweet 16
My new George Sit Down Longarm quilting machine arrived. My Sweet 16 had broken once again, so I went ahead and purchased the George. Wouldn't you know it Mario, at Sewing Machines Plus fixed my Sweet 16 (bought used). We will see how long that last. It lasted four months last time. But he thinks he found the problem and fixed it for free as the last fix hadn't lasted. My Sweet 16 does not have a high stitch count on it. Sweet 16s are generally considered very reliable but this one just had some problems. I was not enthusiastic about the new George as I figured I had a made a mistake ordering new machine.
I looked at both machines (used) at the Road to CA show several years ago. I liked the George better but it was more expensive and I decided to go with the Sweet 16 I purchased it for $3000 used. The new George was ~$8000 and they threw in a ruler foot I wanted. New Sweet 16 is about $6500 but I bet you can get it for less.
There are two different philosophies with these machines:
HQ Sweet 16 relies on a large contingent of dealers who do a good job of servicing their machines. I did have an email session with the techs at HQ and brought back what I found to Mario, and then he further refined the diagnosis. You need to bring the machine in to do general maintenance and tuneups. Oiling the machine requires 6 different oils. I have found my mechanic to be very good. General Maintenance was $200. My machine was not under warranty.
APQS does not have a lot of dealers. The nearest one to me in San Diego is 90 minutes away. I could bring the machine to him for repairs. They rely on an in house staff of people to help you. They have three women on staff who's job is to provide technical support. You can do the maintenance and most of the repairs at home with their assistance. They do tell you to keep the box so if you need to ship the machine box you have the original packaging. The machine was delivered off a big truck on a pallet. It took me about an hour to set up the table (husbands help) and machine (on my own). The instructions were good with lots of pictures. After that I was quilting a practice piece, then quilting the quilt I was working. They have a lifetime warranty. This and the do your own maintenance/little repairs was a big selling point for me. IF you have an APQS dealer near you this is a moot point.
Here's the comparison. Just to give you some background I'm very proficient (not professional) at FMQ.
Sweet 16 is orientated with the head front to back. George is orientated side to side like a regular sewing machine. I like side better. I think the visibility is better. Both have good lights on the machine. George has two sets and they are better.
George comes with an L or M (larger) bobbin. Since I FMQ pretty slowly I chose the M bobbin (and I had a big supply of these). The only time I had to resort to videos when setting up the machine was when I threaded the bobbin. The bobbin case has an extra little twisty thing on it. I just googled it and found a video to help. Sweet 16 came with an M bobbin. Both machines come with a bobbin winder. I haven't tried the APQS George winder yet. The George bobbin is to the side underneath the machine., there is a little clear window you remove to get to the bobbin. The Sweet 16 bobbin is in front underneath the machine. The Sweet 16 is a little easier to access.
It was much easier to get my stitches even with the George machine. The foot pedal is better on the George. I Don't feel the need for a stitch regulator with the George which is a good thing because it doesn't come with one. The sweet 16 had an add on stitch regulator that I didn't like when I tried it. I felt I had a lot more control with the George. My quilting improved a bit immediately from this.
The George machine seems a better thought out. As I was putting it together I noticed things that would make my life easier. You are able to manually move the needle with out going to the other side of the machine. It is within reach of you while your sitting if you need to do something weird. I needed this when trying to determine what was wrong with my sweet 16 and I ended up getting someone to help me. George lighting and foot pedal are better. Both machines go in and out of the table pretty easily. The George table is bigger where you need it to be bigger and easier to move as the legs fold in all the way.
Both machines have needle up/down. The Sweet 16 has a screen that you use to control everything. The George uses dials and buttons so I hope there is less to go wrong. The electronics were what went wrong on my Sweet 16.
They don't take the same needles. The George is a little harder to thread because you thread side to side up against something. By the end of my session I had figured out how to angle the thread and was having an easier time. So this may not be an issue.
The manual for the George is extensive, with many pictures, as it has to be if you are doing maintenance and repairs. The Sweet 16 manual is less extensive but good. I used videos for both Sweet 16 and once for George.
I've had a some thread breakage on the George. I was using Aurifil cotton thread. I took a look at the manual last night and with cotton thread it helps to use a poly bobbin. I'll try same color Superior Sew Fine 50 in the bobbin and see if that makes a difference. If that doesn't work I'll call APQS help line and ask. I got a much better finish after a breakage with the George machine than I do with the Sweet 16. It was much harder to tell where I started up again than it does with my Sweet 16. The APQS people sent me Glide thread and bobbins and some Superior bobbins, that I assume are bottom line.
I was able to use all threads with the Sweet 16. It took adjusting the bobbin case as well as the top tension. I anticipate the same for the George.
I'm very happy with the George so far. It is going to be my forever machine. Because I do intricate FMQ I think a sitdown is the right machine and George seems to be the right one for me. Two odd things that happened with George is: the very knowledgeable sales man referred to the sewing technicians as girls. It turns out they are very proficient women mechanics. I thought at first they were hiring teenagers to help trouble shoot. The machine comes with a Christian symbol (dove ) on it. Someone else pointed that out to me, as at first I didn’t recognize it as that.
A friend and I are quilting every Thursday outside. She is going to put my Sweet 16 through a rigorous test of quilting her next king sized quilt. I also plan to bring my Sweet 16 with me to Omaha when I go for a 6 month visit there in October. After that if the machine is still working I'll sell it in Omaha or San Diego. I won't feel good about selling this machine unless I can prove its working well for a long period of time. .
I hope this review is helpful. Ask questions and I'll try to answer them.
George info: https://www.apqs.com/machines/george/
Sweet 16 https://handiquilter.com/sweet-sixteen/
I looked at both machines (used) at the Road to CA show several years ago. I liked the George better but it was more expensive and I decided to go with the Sweet 16 I purchased it for $3000 used. The new George was ~$8000 and they threw in a ruler foot I wanted. New Sweet 16 is about $6500 but I bet you can get it for less.
There are two different philosophies with these machines:
HQ Sweet 16 relies on a large contingent of dealers who do a good job of servicing their machines. I did have an email session with the techs at HQ and brought back what I found to Mario, and then he further refined the diagnosis. You need to bring the machine in to do general maintenance and tuneups. Oiling the machine requires 6 different oils. I have found my mechanic to be very good. General Maintenance was $200. My machine was not under warranty.
APQS does not have a lot of dealers. The nearest one to me in San Diego is 90 minutes away. I could bring the machine to him for repairs. They rely on an in house staff of people to help you. They have three women on staff who's job is to provide technical support. You can do the maintenance and most of the repairs at home with their assistance. They do tell you to keep the box so if you need to ship the machine box you have the original packaging. The machine was delivered off a big truck on a pallet. It took me about an hour to set up the table (husbands help) and machine (on my own). The instructions were good with lots of pictures. After that I was quilting a practice piece, then quilting the quilt I was working. They have a lifetime warranty. This and the do your own maintenance/little repairs was a big selling point for me. IF you have an APQS dealer near you this is a moot point.
Here's the comparison. Just to give you some background I'm very proficient (not professional) at FMQ.
Sweet 16 is orientated with the head front to back. George is orientated side to side like a regular sewing machine. I like side better. I think the visibility is better. Both have good lights on the machine. George has two sets and they are better.
George comes with an L or M (larger) bobbin. Since I FMQ pretty slowly I chose the M bobbin (and I had a big supply of these). The only time I had to resort to videos when setting up the machine was when I threaded the bobbin. The bobbin case has an extra little twisty thing on it. I just googled it and found a video to help. Sweet 16 came with an M bobbin. Both machines come with a bobbin winder. I haven't tried the APQS George winder yet. The George bobbin is to the side underneath the machine., there is a little clear window you remove to get to the bobbin. The Sweet 16 bobbin is in front underneath the machine. The Sweet 16 is a little easier to access.
It was much easier to get my stitches even with the George machine. The foot pedal is better on the George. I Don't feel the need for a stitch regulator with the George which is a good thing because it doesn't come with one. The sweet 16 had an add on stitch regulator that I didn't like when I tried it. I felt I had a lot more control with the George. My quilting improved a bit immediately from this.
The George machine seems a better thought out. As I was putting it together I noticed things that would make my life easier. You are able to manually move the needle with out going to the other side of the machine. It is within reach of you while your sitting if you need to do something weird. I needed this when trying to determine what was wrong with my sweet 16 and I ended up getting someone to help me. George lighting and foot pedal are better. Both machines go in and out of the table pretty easily. The George table is bigger where you need it to be bigger and easier to move as the legs fold in all the way.
Both machines have needle up/down. The Sweet 16 has a screen that you use to control everything. The George uses dials and buttons so I hope there is less to go wrong. The electronics were what went wrong on my Sweet 16.
They don't take the same needles. The George is a little harder to thread because you thread side to side up against something. By the end of my session I had figured out how to angle the thread and was having an easier time. So this may not be an issue.
The manual for the George is extensive, with many pictures, as it has to be if you are doing maintenance and repairs. The Sweet 16 manual is less extensive but good. I used videos for both Sweet 16 and once for George.
I've had a some thread breakage on the George. I was using Aurifil cotton thread. I took a look at the manual last night and with cotton thread it helps to use a poly bobbin. I'll try same color Superior Sew Fine 50 in the bobbin and see if that makes a difference. If that doesn't work I'll call APQS help line and ask. I got a much better finish after a breakage with the George machine than I do with the Sweet 16. It was much harder to tell where I started up again than it does with my Sweet 16. The APQS people sent me Glide thread and bobbins and some Superior bobbins, that I assume are bottom line.
I was able to use all threads with the Sweet 16. It took adjusting the bobbin case as well as the top tension. I anticipate the same for the George.
I'm very happy with the George so far. It is going to be my forever machine. Because I do intricate FMQ I think a sitdown is the right machine and George seems to be the right one for me. Two odd things that happened with George is: the very knowledgeable sales man referred to the sewing technicians as girls. It turns out they are very proficient women mechanics. I thought at first they were hiring teenagers to help trouble shoot. The machine comes with a Christian symbol (dove ) on it. Someone else pointed that out to me, as at first I didn’t recognize it as that.
A friend and I are quilting every Thursday outside. She is going to put my Sweet 16 through a rigorous test of quilting her next king sized quilt. I also plan to bring my Sweet 16 with me to Omaha when I go for a 6 month visit there in October. After that if the machine is still working I'll sell it in Omaha or San Diego. I won't feel good about selling this machine unless I can prove its working well for a long period of time. .
I hope this review is helpful. Ask questions and I'll try to answer them.
George info: https://www.apqs.com/machines/george/
Sweet 16 https://handiquilter.com/sweet-sixteen/
Last edited by mjpEncinitas; 02-12-2021 at 10:19 AM.
02-12-2021, 11:30 AM
#2
Super Member
Join Date: Nov 2017
Location: Portland, OR
Posts: 2,244
Thank you for the detailed review and information. I am in snow here in Portland and loved looking at your sunny warm backyard as you get familiar with George. I am excited to see you finish some quilts with your new forever machine.
