No Fabric Boycott Needed - Inform Yourself
11-25-2011, 07:05 AM
#54
Super Member
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Western Nevada
Posts: 2,520
Originally Posted by ghostrider
Please give specifics. The only place I have seen any turmoil on this issue is on message boards, forums and blogs. There is no factual information anywhere, just rumor, heresay, speculation, panic and hysteria.
I have spoken with fabric retailers, large and small, and they are not concerned. I suspect the Emily Cier case that Prism mentioned is based entirely on the right of public display granted to copyright owners (the exception of display in person by a legal copy owner does not fit if you publish a picture in a book) and has absolutely nothing at all to do with this 'not for commercial use' hoopla.
Show me proof that anyone has brought suit against anyone else for selling something made from fabric restricted by 'not for commercial use' on the selvage. We are NOT talking about licensed fabrics, trademarked designs, or anything other than simple, straight-forward quilting fabric restricted to 'personal use only' by the designer. So much rumor (how many threads are going on this subject now?), so little proof.
And FYI, olebat, one item sold one time constitutes 'commercial'. It is not a matter of quantity, legal organization, or intent.
I have spoken with fabric retailers, large and small, and they are not concerned. I suspect the Emily Cier case that Prism mentioned is based entirely on the right of public display granted to copyright owners (the exception of display in person by a legal copy owner does not fit if you publish a picture in a book) and has absolutely nothing at all to do with this 'not for commercial use' hoopla.
Show me proof that anyone has brought suit against anyone else for selling something made from fabric restricted by 'not for commercial use' on the selvage. We are NOT talking about licensed fabrics, trademarked designs, or anything other than simple, straight-forward quilting fabric restricted to 'personal use only' by the designer. So much rumor (how many threads are going on this subject now?), so little proof.
And FYI, olebat, one item sold one time constitutes 'commercial'. It is not a matter of quantity, legal organization, or intent.
The "Emily Cier" case really doesn't have anything to do with "Not for Commercial Use" printed on the fabric selvedge.
The former is a designer trying to prevent a pattern designer from using images of her fabrics in a book. Why, we don't know. The manufacturer of the fabric apparently gave needed permission. Perhaps the fabric designer has had a falling-out with the manufacturer, it happens quite often in the business.
But that case really has NO bearing on the item of concern here, and I don't understand why people are getting worked up about it. What most of us really want to know is if we need to pay attention to the selvedge statements "Not for commercial use, etc" and whether we need to worry about being sued over making a couple of placemats or pot-holders or soft books or crib quilts and then selling them at our local craft fair, etc.
And the fact is -- No, you don't, unless you are buying the fabric wholesale and mass-manufacturing/mass-marketing the items. The notices on fabric are put there mainly to restrain large-scale manufacturers from using licensed fabrics to manufacture items, thereby co-opting the original licensor from their lawful use of their designs, and more specifically, to prevent the licensed manufacturer from selling the fabric into the manufacturing market.
So, the licensor can require that the manufacturer puts the notice on the fabric, they can also dictate who to and for what purpose the fabric is sold by the manufacturer, restraining them from selling the fabric to manufacturers of merchandise. Thus, the manufacturer is forced to sell the fabric only into the retail market. Once it has been sold into the retail market, the licensor CANNOT in fact dictate to the end retail customer what purpose the fabric is put to by that retail customer.
This is well-established in legal decisions. Original licensors, if they've done their homework, already know they don't have a case, so it's highly unlikely they'll waste money coming after you, the home crafter.
There have been several cases of companies trying, and in every case, they've failed.
Last edited by QKO; 11-25-2011 at 07:23 AM.
11-25-2011, 07:25 AM
#55
Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Brooklyn, NY
Posts: 814
These threads are very interesting to me, even though at this point I am no where near able to sell any of my projects. Just to play devils advocate, there might be another reason for printing "no commercial use" on their fabrics. In this sue-happy society we live in, these manufacturers might be attempting to protect themselves from litigation. Hypothetically, imagine I buy Disney fabric and make a tote which I sell at a flee market. Someone gives this to their child who then injures themselves with the bag. May be the kid was allergic to something on the bag, or they pinched themselves with the zipper, or God-forbid, they strangled themselves with the strap. These days, people will look for someone to sue over something like this. Are they gonna sue a lady who sells stuff at flea markets, or Disney? They could look for a lawyer who will try to make some legal argument how Disney is responsible for an injury. That little line on the selvage might just be extra protection in case of litigation against that company.
11-25-2011, 07:45 AM
#56
Member
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Hartsel, Colorado
Posts: 38
If it's a cease and desist from a law firm you never ignore those. You reply with facts that support your position. In the case of fabric it's Precious Moments, First Sale Doctrine and Equitable Servitude. Amongst others but those are the basics.
11-25-2011, 07:52 AM
#57
Super Member
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Massachusetts
Posts: 1,096
Originally Posted by veryvirginia
Then why was a quilter in our area told to stop selling, with threat of lawsuit, items made by her from the Elvis Presley fabric she had purchase? Sorry, but I am still in a quandry.
and 2. even lawyers can be wrong. If you read the background of some of the examples on the www.tabberone.com website you'll see many instances of lawyers pushing for 'cease and desist orders' who are found to be wrong in a court of law, evidenced by the sited court cases.
Just two of the reasons this issue is so confusing for people.
11-25-2011, 08:55 AM
#59
Junior Member
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Northern California
Posts: 267
[QUOTE=olebat;4714309]Before everyone gets upset over the selvage statements, please inform yourself of the true meaning of the selvage or bolt end statements, such as, "licensed fabric," "personal use only," or "non-commercial home use only". Today, I spoke with the owner of a business, a LQS owner, and did some research. This site is boiled down into simple terms that we should all be able to understand. http://www.tabberone.com/Trademarks/...edFabric.shtml [SIZE=4] If, after reading this link, you still want to avoid the purchase of these fine fabrics, O.K. That will just leave more for those of us who understand that we are not breaking the law...
11-25-2011, 09:07 AM
#60
Junior Member
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Southeastern PA.
Posts: 190
Originally Posted by olebat
Before everyone gets upset over the selvage statements, please inform yourself of the true meaning of the selvage or bolt end statements, such as, "licensed fabric," "personal use only," or "non-commercial home use only". Today, I spoke with the owner of a business, a LQS owner, and did some research. This site is boiled down into simple terms that we should all be able to understand. http://www.tabberone.com/Trademarks/...edFabric.shtml If, after reading this link, you still want to avoid the purchase of these fine fabrics, O.K. That will just leave more for those of us who understand that we are not breaking the law.
This was a good subject to discuss because there was obviously some misunderstanding. If you were struck with panic, and spread the words to friends or other sites, please go back and correct your statements before we are accused of starting an urban legend.
If your LQS, discount store, thrift shop, internet sales, or wherever, sells fabric, you (the buyer) are safe. Buy what you want, make whatever you want, sell it where ever you want and let the stores continue to stock the fabrics which they think will move in their area.
This was a good subject to discuss because there was obviously some misunderstanding. If you were struck with panic, and spread the words to friends or other sites, please go back and correct your statements before we are accused of starting an urban legend.
If your LQS, discount store, thrift shop, internet sales, or wherever, sells fabric, you (the buyer) are safe. Buy what you want, make whatever you want, sell it where ever you want and let the stores continue to stock the fabrics which they think will move in their area.
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