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Thread: Singer stylist machine mod 413 ser#fc709655

  1. #1
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    Singer stylist machine mod 413 ser#fc709655

    Can anyone tell anything about this Machine what year it was made. I bought it at a yard sale for 5 dollars it is very. Heavy. 22 pounds

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    Super Member J Miller's Avatar
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    Ileen,

    The Singer 413 is your basic SS / ZZ machine. It will do some stretch stitches. It does not use cams. This model was made from 1972 to 1973.
    It's a decent machine with the body made from cast aluminum ( not heavy at all compared to a cast iron machine ).
    They use low shank feet and attachments, regular 15x1 needles and either the metal or plastic Class 66 bobbins. The bobbins depends on the bobbin case. Metal to metal, plastic to plastic.
    Manuals can be had from: { http://www.singerco.com/accessories/instruction-manuals }
    It does have one weakness and that is vertical shaft top gear. It's plastic and they have a tendency to break. I've had two of these machines, and both of them broke that gear. Considering they are over 40 years old, it's not really that surprising.
    The gears can be had and they are not terribly expensive or hard to replace.

    Joe

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    Thanks Joe for all of that imformation now i am going to try. And find the metal bobbin for it.

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    Super Member J Miller's Avatar
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    Sew-Classic has good bobbins for a reasonable price.

    Joe

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    Thanks a lot

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    I also have a model 413, but mine was made in 1961. The vertical shaft top gear arrived yesterday, and I thought I'd ordered the timing belt, but I got the motor belt by mistake (my error). I'm considering replacing it myself following a tutorial I saw on Ebay.

    Any good hints to make my repair job easier? A friend of mine advised taking pictures at each step BEFORE I remove something so I can see how it goes back together.

    Funny thing..it has a plastic bobbin case, but the machine had a metal bobbin in it. I don't know why my grandmother didn't use plastic bobbins, but maybe the bobbin was from another machine she had before and just didn't buy any more. The manual does say to use clear plastic bobbins.
    Last edited by labeelady; 02-14-2013 at 06:54 PM. Reason: add text
    Pat H
    Carencro LA

  7. #7
    Super Member J Miller's Avatar
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    Pat,

    According to ISMACS { http://www.ismacs.net/singer_sewing_...s-400-499.html } the 413 series was made from 1972 to 1978. (the 1973 in my post above is a typo). The 413 from 72 to 73 and the 413K from 72 to 78.

    I am NOT an X-spurt on these machine but I have done two vertical shaft top gear replacements. I'll try to describe what I did.

    >Remove: the slide plate, needle plate, bobbin case, presser foot, then the top, the face plate, the bottom plate and the plastic trim on the front of the machine.
    >Loosen the timing belt adjuster and slip the belt up off of the drive gear. Easier than taking the belt off.
    (NOTE: At this point check the vertical movement of the shaft. You'll want to get it as close to this as you can when you put the new gear on. I should have checked mine with a gap gauge (feeler gauge) before I took the gear off, but I didn't think of it. )
    >Using a long hollow ground screwdriver, slip it in from the outside of the machine through the "STITCH WIDTH" lever slot, loosen the two set screws on the gear. These screws will be VERY TIGHT. So make sure the screwdriver is straight into the slot.
    >Then you'll need to reach under the bottom and pull the shaft down just enough to slip the old gear out.
    >While the shaft is down and the old gear is out you'll need to clean all the debris and gear fragments out of the top of the machine and especially out of the teeth of the driving gear.
    >Then slip the new gear in and push the shaft back up. Do not set the gear so far down on the shaft it is too tight. There needs to be just a tiny bit of play in it.
    >Once you get it on and set so there isn't too much play, then you will have to tighten those set screws as tight as you can get them. If you don't they will loosen up. Tighten one, then the other, then repeat until you just cannot tighten them any more. Don't be timid with them, remember how tight they were when you took them off.
    >For just because I put some Tri-Flow grease on the gears. I have read yes and no on this but I do know the Tri-Flow synthetic grease won't hurt and probably helps, so I use it.

    At this point the machine is way out of time. Do not worry about where the vertical shaft is in relation to the timing belt, it makes no difference.
    >Look carefully at the needle bar. You'll see two timing marks. Slowly turn the machine until the needle shaft is all the way down. The top mark should just be visible under the bottom of the aluminum piece that moves right to left as the machine ZZs.
    NOTE if the machine binds as you turn it, you got the gear too tight. It should turn freely.
    >Continue turning the hand wheel until the bottom timing mark is at the bottom of the aluminum piece as the needle bar is moving up.
    >Now with the stitch width on "0", the needle position at the center point, and the flexi stitch "off", rotate the hook until it's point is centered behind the needle. ( The repair manual says use a size 18 needle. Probably so you can see through the eye. )
    >Slip the timing belt back on the drive gear and return the adjuster back to were it was. Not too tight.

    You'll need a hex key (Allen wrench) or a bit driver with the correct size hex bit for the driven gear on the bottom of the hook.

    > Slowly rotate the machine several times to seat everything and then reset the needle bar like we did in the step above. The hook will be in the neighborhood, but not in time.
    >Loosen the two set screws on the hook shaft so you can turn the hook. (Before you loosen the set screws check the vertical play in the hook shaft like you did the long shaft. You can get this one too tight or too loose too.)
    >Rotate the hook until the point is centered behind the eye and gently lock down one of the set screws.
    (There may be slack in the system. There was in both of my machines. You might be able to rock the hook back and forth a bit with your fingers. When I timed my two machines I tried to set the hook in the middle of this slack point with it's point behind the needle. I don't know if this is right wrong or what, but they work.)

    >Turn the machine through several rotations again and double check the position of the hook. Adjust as needed.
    >Once you get the hook timing where it needs to be, tighten those two set screws as tight as you can get them, just like you did the those on the top gear.

    >Test run the machine under power and then check the timing one more time. If it's still were it should be reassemble the machine for a thread up test run.

    That is pretty much what I did with the two 413s I had. I gave one away and still have one. My description above is as best as I can describe it. I would suggest you hunt down a service and repair manual. I did mine without one. Taking pics won't hurt either, but other than the external parts of the machine body there isn't anything that needs to be be removed.


    The plastic bobbin case is referred to as the "Apollo hook". I don't know why. Both the plastic and metal bobbin cases use the same design bobbins, the class 66. But the metal bobbins can cause excessive wear on the plastic bobbin cases so they make the plastic ones for that. My wife used both metal and plastic bobbins in her 538 for years and we can't see any abnormal wear in the plastic bobbin case. So I doubt your grandmother's use of the metal ones hurt anything.

    As for the motor belt, do not tighten it too tight. That will bind up the motor and slow the machine down. Just tight enough so it doesn't slip but no more.


    Hope this helps a bit.

    Joe

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    Thanks, Joe, for your detailed instructions. Regarding the date of my machine, I have keyed in the serial number and got the date of 1961. The serial number starts with JE, which was made in Scotland, I think, and the number was issued in 1961. So why would ISMACS say it was made in the 70's? And the machine isn't green, but is a gray color.
    There's an ebay listing for one identical to mine.
    Pat H
    Carencro LA

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    Super Member J Miller's Avatar
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    Pat,

    I do not know the why of it, I just know that's what ISMACS says. That's why I posted a link to the page for the 413s. Serial numbers are not always right. There have been a number of dependencies I've read about.
    Also if you read the listings for the 413 and 413 K you'll see they do note the color difference.

    Joe

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    Any idea what causes this machine to skip every 10 stitches or so? It sews just fine on single fabric, but when I try to sew two pieces together, it skips. I'll get 10 perfect stitches, then one long stitch, then maybe 10 more perfect stitches before it skips again. Someone suggested I change the thread spool and see if it might be the spool that's causing a snag.

    I do know there was a problem with it not sewing right due to the tightness of the timing belt. Once I loosened it a bit, it started sewing again. Could it still need adjustment?
    Pat H
    Carencro LA

  11. #11
    Super Member J Miller's Avatar
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    Well, since it won't sew more than one piece of fabric, I'd start by making positive sure you have the correct needle in the machine.
    It takes a regular 15x1, and that the needle is in the machine correctly. It goes in Flat to the Back. Then make sure that it's threaded properly, the thread goes in Front to Back.
    Of course this is after making sure the bobbin is good and the bobbin area is clean.

    Since there was trouble before, with the timing belt it might be advisable to double check the hook timing as well.

    Joe

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    Changed needle and put on different spool of thread. I had a bonifide Singer needle, but decided it was the same size in length as a topstitching needle I had, so I went with that.

    Interesting problem, which I think may have something to do with timing. It sews single fabrics just fine, but when I switched to two layers, it wouldn't sew in the center position. However, when I changed the needle position to the left, it finally decided to sew on double layers as well as single. Switched needle to right position, and it wouldn't sew a stitch. So now I have a machine that only sews a double layer when the needle is in the left position.

    Anyone have that scenario before?
    Pat H
    Carencro LA

  13. #13
    Super Member J Miller's Avatar
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    Pat,

    I'll bet a Jack-In-The-Box Ultimate Cheese Burger the hook timing is late.

    Put the needle in the center position. Visually verify the needle is in the center of the needle plate slot.
    Remove the needle plate, bobbin case, bobbin and presser foot.
    Remove the face plate and find the scribed timing marks on the needle bar.
    Turn the hand wheel till the needle bar is in it's lowest position. You'll see the top timing mark just at the bottom of the bushing.
    Turn it some more until the bottom timing mark is at the bottom of the bushing.
    Now, look really carefully ...... the point of the hook should be centered behind the needle.

    Is it?

    Joe

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    The timing is not a problem, at least not that I can determine. The hook does pick up the thread like it's supposed to. It's what happens after that operation that might shed some light on it. I did solve one problem that might have affected the timing, as well as shredding thread. Upon inspection of the plastic bobbin case, I discovered a couple of scratches, possibly made by a screwdriver, on the outside of the case in the path where the thread would travel around it. My trusty nail file made short work of those, and now it does sew multiple layers even on the center needle position. However, it is still skipping stitches and sews when it wants to.

    I'm considering taking it in to the shop anyway for a good cleaning and oiling, and hopefully that will make it work better. Might also need some fine tuning which I don't have the tools for.
    Pat H
    Carencro LA

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    Super Member Sandygirl's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ileen View Post
    Thanks Joe for all of that imformation now i am going to try. And find the metal bobbin for it.
    My Stylist is in this age range. Plastic bobbins.
    Sandy
    Sandygirl

    Janome 9900 / Janome 9700 / Janome Decor 3050 / Janome 1100D serger
    Singer Centennial model (inherited from my late, fav aunt!)

  16. #16
    Super Member J Miller's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by labeelady View Post
    The timing is not a problem, at least not that I can determine. The hook does pick up the thread like it's supposed to. It's what happens after that operation that might shed some light on it. I did solve one problem that might have affected the timing, as well as shredding thread. Upon inspection of the plastic bobbin case, I discovered a couple of scratches, possibly made by a screwdriver, on the outside of the case in the path where the thread would travel around it. My trusty nail file made short work of those, and now it does sew multiple layers even on the center needle position. However, it is still skipping stitches and sews when it wants to.

    I'm considering taking it in to the shop anyway for a good cleaning and oiling, and hopefully that will make it work better. Might also need some fine tuning which I don't have the tools for.
    The plastic bobbin case is called the Apollo case and they are still available. Since you found it damaged, it will probably need replacing. They are not interchangeable with the steel bobbin cases. Also, the plastic bobbin cases use the plastic bobbins. You can use the metal ones, but they will cause wear to the bobbin case that the correct bobbin cases wont.

    Joe

  17. #17
    Super Member Sandygirl's Avatar
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    Now if I can remember where that darn cord and foot petal are!

    Sabdy
    Attached Images Attached Images
    Sandygirl

    Janome 9900 / Janome 9700 / Janome Decor 3050 / Janome 1100D serger
    Singer Centennial model (inherited from my late, fav aunt!)

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sandygirl View Post
    Now if I can remember where that darn cord and foot petal are!

    Sabdy
    That is the same machine I have, only mine came with a cabinet. The foot pedal is operated by a knee control. I can remove the foot pedal from the bracket, however, but it's so handy where it is, I'm not touching it.

    Hope you get yours working!
    Pat H
    Carencro LA

  19. #19
    Super Member Sandygirl's Avatar
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    We did not buy it in a cabinet. Knee contol was not part of this machine set up. In a cabinet that just presses the foot control. "Portable" was a cool concept at the time! It has served me well. My parents bought this for me when I was in high school. I know that it was a major purchase for them. It meant so much to me that they sacrificed for my passion for sewing. I used this machine for ever until I bought my sew/embroidery Janome 9700 in 2005. This Stylist needs a major oiling, cleaning. I will find the cords when I have the time to look.

    sandy
    Sandygirl

    Janome 9900 / Janome 9700 / Janome Decor 3050 / Janome 1100D serger
    Singer Centennial model (inherited from my late, fav aunt!)

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sandygirl View Post
    I used this machine for ever until I bought my sew/embroidery Janome 9700 in 2005.

    sandy
    That's a long time using that machine! Did you ever have trouble with the upper gear breaking? The upper gear is what controls the bobbin action, and it's made of plastic. It gets brittle over time and cracks. The one in mine had broken twice. We found one online and I replaced it myself, also learned how to set the timing.
    Pat H
    Carencro LA

  21. #21
    Super Member Sandygirl's Avatar
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    I has been quite a while since it was serviced but to my knowledge, the gear has not broken.
    Sandy
    Sandygirl

    Janome 9900 / Janome 9700 / Janome Decor 3050 / Janome 1100D serger
    Singer Centennial model (inherited from my late, fav aunt!)

  22. #22
    Super Member sewbeadit's Avatar
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    Sandygirl, very pretty machine, hope you get it stitching correctly
    Sewbeadit
    W. Washington

  23. #23
    Super Member Sandygirl's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sewbeadit View Post
    Sandygirl, very pretty machine, hope you get it stitching correctly
    Thank you. Just heading down memory lane makes me smile. Sooooo long ago now. ......

    sandy
    Sandygirl

    Janome 9900 / Janome 9700 / Janome Decor 3050 / Janome 1100D serger
    Singer Centennial model (inherited from my late, fav aunt!)

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