It's hard to say. I've been told that if you design a quilt from a photo that someone else has taken, you need to ask permission.

I agree. If it's against the law, here the copyright law applies, then that alone is enough to guide my morals and values. And this I what I teach my children.

Just my thoughts.

Just because they sell a kit doesn't mean you HAVE to buy it. Almost all of the magazines I get now have kits for the quilts they show. But you can still make it however you want, and aren't obligated to buy the pattern. And if you see an ad for one that you can figure out yourself, I say go for it.

According to a local quilt shop, if you change the pattern by 25% you can claim it as your own. (???)

As to the kit issue. I have made patterns that were from kits, because I loved the colors and the pattern of the kit.
I have also purchased kits that had one or two fabrics that I did not like in any way, so I used my own.
I believe kits are a convenience issue only, and you are certainly NOT obligated to purchase a kit to make a quilt that you love. If that were the case how many of us are already outside of "quilt law" by making patterns we see in magazines that also offered kits???

If you give credit to the designer I would say:
"Inspired by the quilt designed by Jane Doe."

I don't think you have to buy a kit. I personally never have because I enjoy the process of designing with my own colors. I usually change a border on an existing pattern, too so it is my own. Good luck!

I see a mixture of personal views overshadowing the interpretation of copyright. Sure we can all Google it and make our own decisions based on our personal ethics but when you allow those personal ethics to decide that your personal interpretation is what the law intended, well, that's when we cross the line into thinking we are a pseudo-expert and have the ability or enough knowledge to make an eronneous statement of fact. Unless you actually have a law degree and specialize in intellectual property, the opinions expressed here are just that. Opinions.

If you see a dress in the store and go home & make it,that is fine so I say see a quilt go home & make it.Do we really think they are going to come after us? Gee they don't even know us! I say make what you want too!

I've always wondered about this. Seemed to me a pattern designer could not tell you what you could do with the finished product you made from their pattern. So do I understand this correctly; If I legally obtain a pattern, I am free to do with the finished quilt whatever I want, so long as I am not in any way claiming the design as my own. I can sell the quilt or show it in a show (in a category for non original quilts)?

Another thing I have always wondered about: If I purchase a pattern, is it then mine to do with as I wish? I know I cannot reproduce it and give it away copies of it. However if I make and sell 100 quilts from it, as long as I acknowledge the designer is that fair game?

By the way this is just a rhetorical question, I am NEVER going to make the same quilt twice, let alone 100 times, LOL Too many beautiful things out there and dancing through my head.

If you're an inspired quilter (aren't we all to some degree), my guess is that you'll end up changing SOMETHING so that's it's not exactly like the kit quilt. Your borders, etc. will evolve to be different, so it will become somewhat of your own design. But I definitely believe you shouldn't sell it in any way; that's unethical. HAVE FUN QUILTING!

If you can figure it out...make it!!! 8-)

I have asked about just buying patterns and have been able to - I think you will be fine as you are not profitting from the work - also there are so many blocks out there - have fun

If you can do it on your own, why bother with the kit? If you're not planning to sell it, I guess you have the freedom to do whatever you want with your own fabric and your own time.

this I agree with....I don't think I have ever made a quilt ENTIRELY like any pattern....I can add, leave something out, or use one block in the whole quilt...Am I wrong in saying if a designer puts a pattern in a quilt magazine you can make it, sell it or do anything you want....?????

Don't sell the pattern as your own design or claim it as your design. Give the designer full credit. Do what you want with the quilt you made from the pattern, purchased or not.

Many many patterns and kits are made from traditional block designs that have been handed down through centuries or decades. If you look at a quilt-- just look at it, not measure it-- and you can make it, I say go ahead.

You will need to determine the size of the block, how many pieces needed of each shape, which colors go where, the size of the quilt, how big and how many borders, the fabric requirements for top, backing and batting. If you do all that, in my opinion, it's your quilt.

I get confused too. We had this issue of copying and copyright arise with our informal quilt group's annual quilt to be displayed in our local agricultural fair. We hold an in-house quilt raffle (not open to the public). To get a chance for the quilt, our members have to make a quilt square or help set the quilt and frame up or come out to the fair and hand quilt. There is no money involved. We invite the public to sit and quilt with us, hoping to get new members this way.

One year we chose a design featured in an issue of Fons&Porter's magazine--a quilt design that they also had purchased. We put the top together, set it up in the frame, displayed the issue of the Fons&Porter magazine, open to the page with the design on top of the quilt so that credit was given to the designer.

I e-mailed the magazine to make sure we were doing everything legally. Here is what they wrote back. "Each member of our group had to purchase the magazine or have a subscription to the magazine before we could use this design and display it." It turned out that several of us did have yearly subscriptions, but I pointed out that one can read this magazine at the local library, make a copy for one's own use, etc.

We went ahead as usual, but I can tell you we never quite understood this issue of everyone having to buy their magazine. Most of us canceled our subscriptions after this, deciding we would read the library's copy from then on. We never made copies for anyone else.

We felt that those who saw the quilt and then saw the magazine would buy the magazine if they were interested. It was as if "this was a case of cutting off one's nose to spite one's face." We were advertising their magazine and the design within. We were engendering business. What else did the magazine want? :cry:

After the last thread on this issue I thought of a question to go along with it... if we buy a magazine or pattern book and then sell them in a garage sale - or buy one in a garage sale - is that not defeating the purpose of lettin the designer/magazine profit? I have used patterns from magazines and given the quilts as gifts. I'm not a designer but if I were - I'd be honored that someone wanted to make my designed quilt - if they want to sell it -so be it -

most magazines i've seen if they have a kit you can purchase the pattern only. Lok around you may find what you want

If you wouldn't be using the kit why buy it? I don't feel the least bit bad about calculating my own fabric, drawing out patterns and making quilts. I'm going to be using that money to buy fabric anyway and that supports our LQS's too. I do buy patterns if it's one that's complicated enough that I don't want to spend the time or can't figure it out. Most kits don't come in the size that I'd like to make anyway. I saw some at Hancocks the other day that were marked 70%off but by the time I'd have bought what I needed for a kingsize quilt it would have still been $120.

with your experience, I would just make one as close to the one you love,get the picture, enlarge it and take it from there, I do that a lot, I would much rather spent money on fabric I like.

I thought it if it was for personal use only, and you calculate the yardage, redraw the design, it should be OK. How many times have I seen a magazine design that is circles in a square, vatiation on a traditional pattern, strips, etc. Will your EQ6 explode if the design you happen upon is one someone else happened upon?

If you don't need it, don't buy it.

Only the pattern, MAYBE, is copyrighted. And maybe even that may be an old block or collection of blocks.

The kit is not copyrighted at all.

Is there a copyright on the pattern? If not, according to federal law, anyone has a right to it. In a U.S. Supreme Court decision written and handed down by Justice Scalia in June 2003 the Court: Held: Section 43(a) of the Lanham Act does not prevent the unaccredited copying of an uncopyrighted work.

Maybe I'm not understanding the original question....If a quilt pattern is published in a magazine that we buy, then as far as I am aware the pattern is not copyright protected as long as we make it for personal use or for gifting. Making it for entry in a quilt show with money awards for placing should be fine unless the magazine the pattern is published in states contrary. As long as it not sold to make money for the quilt maker (not the quilt designer). Otherwise, why would patterns be put out in magazines??

All of my LQS have kits but you can also buy only the pattern and pick from the fabric whatever you like

I do the same. Sometimes I see a picture in a magazine or a finished quilt in a shop. I try to remember and make a drawing back home. Then I try to figure out how I can make it. The funny thing is, most of the time the finished product looks very different. Is it my own design, afterwards ???

I do agree with Pittsburgpam...you're right on the money with your analysis!
Kind Regards,
MaryAnna

If you are a quilter, you are an artist as far as I am concerned!! I plan on doing what I have always done. Those who do not like it can ...... go away. Sue me!!!!!

I had this problem one time. I tried to buy a pattern I wanted but no one had it. It sounded as if it was out of print. I made the quilt from the catalog picture, I used different fabric/color. About a year later the pattern started showing up again. I felt a little guilty. After thinking about it, I decided, If you are not selling, I think it is okay to copy if you have the ability. There are so many free quilt patterns out there now. I would buy a pattern if it was unique. Actually I have bought a lot of patterns and books, they rival my stash.

Some of the off the rack clothes are copies of designer clothes and it seems to be an accepted practice. What's the difference?

"original" what makes a design original in the first place. I don't think I have ever seen a quilt that wasn't made up of blocks from the past...The only block to me that might even be considered original would be a appliqué that the designer drew the subject from her own mind... or a paper pieced block done the same way. Take a look at the Civil War quilt made by Jane A. Stickle of Vermont. She finished the quilt in 1863 and it has over 200 blocks in it if I can remember right...they are all different, but yet you see these blocks all the time in quilts. Is it arrangement considered original then?

A good example of an original quilt is this one:

http://www.quiltingboard.com/t-46363-1.htm

COPYRIGHT INFORMATION: If your quilt was made from a commercial book or pattern, or from a pattern found in a magazine, you MUST also include a copy of the designer's permission for you to sell your quilt.

You cannot profit from someone else's work unless you have his or her permission. When you purchase a pattern, it's understood that you will be making the quilt for your personal use. However, if you are then going to sell the quilt, you will be profiting from the designer's work. You cannot do this unless you have WRITTEN permission from the designer.

I have copied the above information; there is more regarding public domain quilt blocks: specific design elements, color, fabric, scale, measurements ... if you have followed a designer's directions to make the quilt, then you must receive written permission before you sell the quilt. It also states that any small variations or color scheme changes to the pattern do not release you from the copyright ... you will still need the designer's written permission to sell the quilt. Same rules apply to quilts displayed at shows and exhibits. You cannot use a photo of a quilt to create your own quilt and then sell it.

While I have only one page of copyright info., nowhere does it say we can't copy a catalog photo of a kit and keep the resulting quilt for ourselves, nor does it say we cannot give the quilts away ... it only refers to selling quilts. I'm assuming that if I give a quilt to someone, they can't sell it either without the designer's written permission, but I don't know ... it doesn't say.

The copyright applies to the pattern and to the instructions, not to the quilt that you make from the pattern. This means that you cannot claim that the pattern is yours, sell the pattern, or enter the pattern in a quilt show as your original design.

Some blocks and quilt designs are part of quilting culture and belong to everyone. Others are original to a specific designer, copyrighted or not.

If someone has taken the time to apply for a copyright, then they can sue for damages, if you publish or claim their pattern as your own. If it isn't copyrighted, then it becomes a matter of personal ethics, plagiarism, and not a legal issue.

When someone else's idea sparks creativity in you and you make it your own, then the resulting pattern is yours. Typically changing about 25% of a pattern is considered to be enough change to make the pattern new and yours. In this case, someone should not be able to look at your new pattern and say, "This quilt pattern is exactly like so and so's quilt pattern." If you have any doubt about the significance of your changes, use the inspired by .... on your new quilt pattern.

In my opinion, the answer to the original question before us is not about buying the kit; one cannot copyright what fabric must be used in a quilt pattern. The question is about the pattern, and the solution remains in examining the quilter's intent.

Does the quilter intend to copy the pattern or is this pattern a source of inspiration? The answer to this question is the answer to the question, "Should I buy the pattern."

I hope this makes sense to all who are worried.

I think if you no the pattern, and how to make it. I would not buy it. God bless. Penny

After all the pages of this thread. I'm afraid to buy another pattern. I haven't sold my quilts, yet, I usually give them away. But if I wanted to sell a quilt, is there a quilt police checking every quilt ever sold? I understand it's an ethical question, but it sure is taking the fun out of quilting and replacing it with fear. When a LQS makes a quilt for a sample and then later sells it, do they have to have to asked the designer? Who has this kind of time? Find the designer's address, write the designer, wait for the answer. In the mean time has the buyer changed their mind? How much of the quilt design can you change, the color, size, quilting design stitches? I could not make something exactly the same if I tried nor would I want to.

The copyright info. that I quoted on page 5 of this thread was included in my Keepsake Quilting Gold Club membership package, so anyone who disagrees with it could discuss it with Keepsake Quilting.

My theory is that if you do not buy/use a pattern, but copy all or part of a quilt or kit from a magazine or catalog, it would be very difficult for anyone to prove that you did that and hard to imagine that anyone would bother to try. Frankly, I don't worry about it because I don't sell quilts or patterns, but if I were selling quilts, I would want to stay within the law.

I've been reading this thread about using patterns and selling them. If the designer didn't want you to copy, use, sell or giveaway their patterns why would they put them in a magazine that you purchased for 6 or 7 dollars. Most of my work has been through these articles.Enough siad , let's move on

I like this idea, just put inspired by: on the label.