Another Mag with the same statement about who can make what for who and who has control over what you make. I've heard so many of you say you are cancelling your subscription of McCalls because of the copyright statement in the front of the magazine. Well, I just got my issue of Quilter's Home mag and it has the same statement in it. I'm only due one more issue and I won't be renewing my subscription to this mag or any other. I will be checking from now on. Thanks for the other thread about this topic! I just went and Googled Creative Crafts Group, LLC and Quilter's Home is under the same umbrella as McCalls as well as a bunch of other magazines, so if anyone else is thinking of discontinuing your subscription or for any other reason you might want to check them out, you can find out who has this statement in their magazine. Just my little rant. Thanks for listening!

Its on the internet too. I just pulled down a pattern and the website stated "For home use only. For other uses please contact me for permission atxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx" Not for salable items.

I can understand not wanting everybody and their uncle (or aunt) making $ off of your design, but I really don't see how you can keep people from looking at the picture or the finished product and doing something very much like it even without buying the pattern. Once I see something, I can pretty much figure out how it was done and if I want to do one more or less like it, I can. Now even when I buy a pattern, I don't often do it just like the pattern anyway, so in one sense I've made it my own even with a pattern.

If I were going to set up a manufacturing plant and make hundreds of thousands of them, using their patten exactly, that would be a totally different issue, but if I'm doing several dozen over a period of months, and I didn't have the pattern or else modified the pattern to my own specifications, I hardly see the copyright issue as totally relevant.

Why do they bothe to publish!!!!!

We ran into a problem with a free mystery pattern posted on the Internet. When we asked to use it at the retreat we were refused and told it was for shop use only. Another one posted on the internet we had to pay $50 to use it for a mystery quilt. Be very careful. But we figured even in this huge state of AK we might be tattled on. It is a scary world out there. Sue happy people.

I understand if you don't buy the pattern and figure it out by yourself just add your stamp (variation) to it and it can be called original. (?)

That's sad considering many of these have been made for years, the economy's in the tank and only the exclusive believe they have the right to limit other view points and variations, considering some use could be the difference between feeding and cloting your family. Not that others aren't trying to do the same, Micro buisness vs Big buisness, and who profits??
I don't like limiting any one to make a living, at any level, some things are not legally, but morally questionable.
Whew off the box I come.

Thats passion lady,passion and that is what makes change.

There are some patterns and designs that appear to me to be truly original.

Where things get stuck in my craw is when someone takes old stand by blocks - like 9-patch, shoo-fly, variable star, rail fence - and then claims a copyright for the pattern.

I don't generally weigh in on topics like this but it has been consistent and confusing.

This is my view point (right or wrong) - I have paid for the pattern so what I make with it is my business and what I do with it after that is my business.

I understand I should not re-sell the pattern and especially not for a profit. I also have no problem with respecting not copying it and sharing it with others.

I strongly believe their control over a quilt should END with the purchasing of the pattern.

Just my thoughts ;)

You know, copyrights are troublesome! It would seem to me quilter's around the world would be happy to share their patterns. Selling the patterns is different than placing it free in a magazine or online. It would seem to me that if you are posting the pattern for use, whether it is for the home or whatever, it's up for grabs! Who is to say it should not be made and sold? If the person who designed it wanted to have full proceeds from said pattern, then they should not sell the pattern or post it as free. The joy of making a quilt is to give, of course, but selling one should be the right of anyone who labors at it. Maybe making a slight change in the pattern might avoid such problems, but it still seems a bit overboard to police quilts for patent (copyright) violations! Just my opinion....


Oh, And I agree with you, Conniequilts

That's what bothers me the MOST too - I don't care to sell quilts or enter a lot of shows - but I DO have a real problem with "quilt designers" making very repetitive quilts with nothing more than triangles, nine-patches, strips, stars or snowballs etc and claiming they are their ORIGINAL patterns & designs ???
Come on, these traditional blocks have been around for 150+ years ... in the public domain, to be used & enjoyed by ALL
Unless it is someone's hand-drawn, pictorial pattern or applique design, it's pretty silly to consider anything else an "original" design :roll:

I agree with you all. If a pattern or even a mystery quilt is published for the whole world to see, why can't the public use it for free to do with as they may. Just because someone has changed a block around does not mean they OWN it. I also can take about any pattern or block I see and copy or change it as I see fit. Then it is mine to do with as I wish. The magazine publishers are only hurting them selves, their circulation will go down, then they will have to charge more for advertising and magazine prices, who's going to buy them. NOT ME!

Exactly.

No. Unless it is so "in the public domain" that anyone anywhere can use it already.

I think the object is to sell one pattern per person making a given quilt or item.

Right.

They can say anything they want, but saying it does not make it true.

Hello quilterguy - the more this topic is aired, the less clear it becomes but it certainly makes us think and fume at giant corporate and legal domination of our lives. They're control freaks trying to make an easy dollar out of the average person in the street.
Intellectual Property gives us ownership of our thoughts but Artificial Intelligence and man-made laws interfere with our right to do what we think is morally correct :roll:

As a former member of a professional quilt association I can see both sides. With the advent of the longarmers the biggest problem I see is that their work is not being credited to them. I have a friend who is also a handquilter for hire. She did a quilt for a woman who won first place for "handquilting" at Paducha. The problem was she failed to tell the judges that it was not her work. When my friend objected the customer replied that she had paid her so the work belonged to her.
I do believe that once your quilt is published in a commercial magazine all bets are off. As long as you don't sell it claiming that it was your original design I don't see how they could object. To me it is like actors that are so upset about their pictures being published. They need to remember that it is free publicity and conduct themselves accordingly in public. I do make it a point to give a designer credit if I enter or show a piece that uses their design.

Okay - here we go again!!

1) I don't have any money -- they can sue me if they want...they won't get anything.

2) My stuff will probably NEVER be published anywhere....so how would they know

3) I have QE6....would be hard for ANYONE to decide I'd used their pattern.

There hard 100s of patterns out there....ALL of them are a spin-off of some other person's quilt. If a magazine or designer says I can't sell them, then I won't make a quilt from their pattern....but I WILL make one from MY designs.

I always pick up magazines from the store instead of subsribing but will not buy them if that statement is in there. We pay for the magazine so why can't we use the patterns the way we want I thought that was the whole idea of the patterns. Gosh what is this world coming to!

Many valid points above !!
Let me throw a rock in the pot !! Have paid for internet services, and it seems like very little is private if on line, Many patterns are years old, the work and effort should count for something, are painters under the same CR for painting a blade of grass.

OK out my spoon comes.

I knew I would be starting something again and sure enough, here we go again. I'm glad tho, cause I want to help get the word out that I agree with everything everyone has said. Most patterns are in the public domain and we should be able to do whatever the heck we want to with the patterns we buy. After all, we bought them, that makes them ours. Now, I also agree that if it is truely an "original design" the designer should have some control over it, but lets get real here. How many designs these days are truely original? I'd say very few to NONE. Make what you want and do with it what you want. Don't support those who try to suppress your creativity and control what you do with it. My opinion only. Take it or leave it!

Wait until you get into machine embroidery.....copyrights up the kazoo. They monitor what is selling on ebay and craig's list and will come after you if you innocently buy a design. Luckily many are extremely generous with free designs. Buyer beware.

They can sue, but there is nothing for them to take...

Even on some of the sites that we are all very familiar with there are statements about limiting use of the patterns provided there for free...I recently found a block I really loved, but it said I couldn't use it for a class. Guess what...I Googled the name of the block, and I found a pattern from the 1930s of that same block with the same name. I used that block for the class, because I took the "public domain" pattern instead of the one posted with limitations. There are ways around these things. You have to find an alternative source of the block pattern that is old enough to be public domain. Not as hard as it appears. Be creative!! Get a sketchbook and colored pencils and start designing your own. It's really not that hard.

The issue has always been who owns the property. There is a name for it but I am too tired to remember. A good movie/book adressing it is Ayn Rand's "The Fountainhead". The person who owns it can put any use limitations/restrictions they want. As someone suggested, best design your own or live with the restrictions. Essentially when you buy a design(emb. ) you can't change that much of it,claim it as your own or sell the design. This why they have copyright lawyers. Follow the money.

Should we be careful when we purchase food. Might be in small print for "FAMILY USE ONLY". Would that be cheating if we had a guest for a meal?
Some people get to techinal with patterns.

I've been designing for 27 years, and have had to familiarize myself with all of this stuff. I see a couple of things in these threads that worry me.

Copyright doesn't need to be complicated for most people. If you are using someone else's work (be it patten, quilt, or picture of either) - they created it, and it is theirs. I respect their wishes or don't use it if I disagree. Very simple. Re-creating it in EQ, changing a few things, calling it inspiration - doesn't matter, and doesn't change the reality that it is based off of someone else's work. It just shows why designers are becoming more serious about protecting their work. I keep seeing 'who will know' and 'let them sue.'

Copyright is complicated for those trying to protect their work - it can easily get out of the artist's control and cause them to involuntarily loose their rights. One very real aspect of this is people showing quilts at shows and not properly crediting the designer - allowing others to think it is completely their work. We have to diligently defend our copyrights to keep them because of the very 'borrowing' and attitudes that have been detailed in these threads.

I have never seen or heard of a designer being unreasonable when approached about having a quilt shown in a quilt show. Permission to copy for 'guild use' or other uses is dangerous territory - it can so easily be misused. Some quilters are ruining it for everyone.

I believe that we are seeing more public domain blocks used because, quite frankly, a truly original design is nothing more than a headache, and more designers are keeping them to themselves rather than fight with all this. I know I am.

Eventhough I feel the prize and any money should go to the person who payed for the hand quilting the credit should definitely go to the actually person who quilted the quilt. I always see labels that state designer, who pieced it and who quilted it. How can you pretent you quilted it when you did not.

A lot of this stuff-ok most of it-- is addressed in these articles. Relax ladies.

http://www.tabberone.com/Trademarks/...uiltThis.shtml

http://www.tabberone.com/Trademarks/...Quilting.shtml

Point in Question:I was opening other emails and linked to a crafting site and there was a pattern for sale on an item that someone else has given away as a "freebie" ...You want to bet I downloaded the freebie rather than pay $7.00 for a pattern. Perhaps King Solomon was right: :"There is nothing new under the sun"...just variations?

Isn't anyone related to an attorney that could answer this question?

Franie,
I really don't understand why you were denied doing the pattern at a retreat. I mean it is possible a bunch of ladies could just be working on the same pattern at the same time. There's six people in my sewing group and one day three of us showed up doing the same pattern. It sure wasn't planned.

I guess I just don't understand what the question is that's being asked at this point. After reading all of these threads, it seems to me that the conflict is between what copyright law does say, and what people wish copyright law said.

Okay! I have another question. How many people out there have actually had a problem because of CR laws? I've never met one person in the "common" community of quilters to have ever had a problem with this so what is the actual problem and how much damage is actually being done by us little people making quilts for our childeren, etc? I think we should all relax a little and keep on keeping on! I don't really think there are quilt police out there after us!

Hooray!

I just think the copyright laws need to be revamped so people can understand them with out consulting with lawyers to figure it out. Some were along the line it needs to be interpated in common layman turns so we can under stand what we can and can't do. Instead we get legal garble that doesn't make much sense to the common person. I am willing to either get in contact with the copyright office or talk with a person who knows the laws and can tell us exactly what we can and can't do.

[quote=ube quilting]I totally agree that they should have some control but that control is whether to sell it or not! When they sell it they also sell the control.
If I sell you my car I no longer have the right to tell you how to drive said car.
IMHO

Couldn't of said it better.