Singer 31-15: How far can I go before I get myself in trouble?
 

I have a 31-15 that I started to restore last year then set aside.
Pulled it out today and got back to it.
(I know it's not traditional but I think it'll look quite nice in maroon)
The internals aren't rusted - but neither are they nice. Let's call it mild surface corrosion.
Not in the needle bar area but inside the upper housing and underneath.
How far can I take things apart before I get into trouble?
By that I mean there doesn't seem to be a "shop manual" for these and I don't want to get into a situation where I'll never be able to get it back to proper timing etc.
Lew

Up in that area you might try some bicycle chain oil it is for dealing with rusty bike chains. Some times it will remove the rust by friction. Then brush off the rest. I have had success with that a time or two.

I would hold off dis-assembly and begin instead by sitting the machine in a shallow pan and repeatedly sloshing kerosene through it. Dab with a stiff, stub (cut-off) brush where you can reach. Best done outdoors because of the stinky quality of kerosene, but it works beautifully as a solvent and temporary lubricant. After it dries, you'll have to lubricate with standard sewing-machine oil. The 31-15 is a simple machine, so it should respond well to this treatment, and flush superficial oxidation.

Maroon sounds nice. Please post photos when you do it.

I'm thinking Joe uses transmission fluid

Kerosene, then ATF, then Hoppe's #9 gun solvent is the order of things for those machines that are so dirty with caked on oil and debris that sewing machine oil won't do it.

I've never had one that was so bad in the upper arm that I had to take it apart, but I have removed all the inspection plates and cleaned as much as I could reach, then flood it with sewing machine oil to flush out the rest.\

Joe

Good ideas!
Thanks. My natural instinct is to disassemble and polish everything but discretion is the better part of obsession....so to speak.

caked oil and rust rarely are in the same place

My internals aren't nearly as bad as all that.
Just not nice and shiney... which I find vaguely disconcerting.
My guess is a spray of WD-40 followed by a good brushing and wiping and then oiling will do just fine.

I hate WD-40

Hmm - I'm not a fan of WD-40 as a lubricant mainly because it really isn't but as a cleaner I find it effective.
Perhaps you can help me understand why its use in this situation would be inadvisable?

WD-40 is NOT A LUBRICANT! Seriously folks... Triflo or Sewing Machine Oil

PLEASE.. I am tired of having to rescue machines with old dried WD-40 gluing it together....

Apparently you didn't read my post but rather saw the word WD-40 and hit send.

Lew - Yes, I saw your whole post. This message was to everyone who may or may not read this thread completely.

WD-40 is so commonly though to be a lubricant, that I use every opportunity to help reverse that. Sorry if you felt that it was directed at you personally, that was not my intent.

Fair enough. And I agree ...I have seen it misused way too often but there is a time and a place.

...and I use WD-40 a lot FYI. I buy it by the gallon. Just not for sewing machines

I buy it by the little spray can. Then I lose the red straw. Then the nozzle breaks off. Then I buy another little spray can ..:-(

LOL, I buy a gallon at a time and use the refillable WD-40 hand-pump spray bottle.
https://encrypted-tbn3.gstatic.com/s...pvtzE&usqp=CAY

We use it as a wipe down for all of the metalworking tools in the shop (anvils, stakes, swedge block, hammer faces, etc)

This makes me laugh.

If you oil a rusty bike chain, wipe off and keep doing it tentatively for a while most if not all rust will come off. I'm not sure why it works, but it does. A very rusty or worn bike chain needs to be replaced but even the worst cases clean up rather well. I have used very basic stuff, generic brand chain oil usually with a type of rust inhibitor. I have used a lot of brands over the years with much the same results. If I use WD40 I get rust within a couple of days in rainy weather, it's just too thin and wears off. Like miriam mentions, it might work on a slightly corroded surface.

:D :D :D sorry ..reading along ..agreeing w steve & then i read this comment. but you're both right, WD-40 isn't a lubricant!! it's active ingredient is olive oil. i was taught by a numistmast (spelling sorry) years ago to use olive oil to clean & remove rust, or rejuvenate oxidized painted surfaces. i used to collect tins & painted trays. for those items, olive oil works wonders,but i only use WD-40 to loosen & clean my clippers & rusted bolts. and clean my metal tape measures before putting away for the winter after a summer of laying out lines etc out in the dirt (spelled s i l t).

it's the acid in olive oil in the WD-40. the #40 is from fact that it was the 40th attempt at creating working recipe that succeeded. ie - WD-40

I thought it was Stoddard solvent

I have tried to look up the ingrediens in WD40, the closest I have come is a safety data sheet. From what I can remember it's mostly hexane and various petroleum derived oils. Hexane would make it evaporate fast and leave the dry film. I don't know what the secret ingredient is, the maker swears it does't gum up or contain either vegetable oil or whale oil. On the web you can find the funniest claims to this oil, some of them hardly believable LOL ;)

WD40 doesn't really contribute anything. You have to remove every bit of it. I use the aforementioned bicycle chain oil, TriFlow. It kills the rust and makes things move that didn't before. It removed rust from attachments and I was able to shine them. Otherwise I would have discarded them because the rust was so bad. It can't replace lost plating, but it can take away the nasty rust.

I stumbled on the bike chain oil by accident. I was in the bike store and they were out of Tri-Flow. So I bought the chain oil. I didn't like it at all so I set it aside. Then one day I had a really nasty machine and thought hhhhhmmmmm I wonder if the bike chain oil would work on that - it did. I'm hooked. I think it has a detergent in it or something. But it sure does get the rust out of there. I have a machine that was totally rusted up in the nose area - I should get it out and see how it is doing after sitting a couple years. That chain oil is thick. I don't recommend it for every day use.

Well I just dug it out and that machine turns like a champ! The rust is still gone!

I have tried to get to the botton of rust removers and inhibitors. Oil in itself is rust inhibiting, the added substances vary from maker to maker. I haven't managed to get a general view of them, but on the bottles are alkanolamine salts, alkylbenzene sulfonate, polyethers, benzotriazol and molybdenium often mentioned. These are the additives typically 1% or less of the full content, I have no idea what they are. There's rarely a full list of ingredients, often secret recipes and a pinch of hype, they tend to work though.

There are two oils they sell in bicycles stores I have bought repeatedly for years now; Triflow and Finish Line Ceramic Wet lube. They are both much the same light synthetic oil with added teflon, noticeably a notch or two better than the basic mineral oil. Bike oils are usually thicker than sewing machine oil, often added a sticky agent to make it coat chains and stay there in all kinds of weather. Because of this they can be very gooey. Triflow is sold as an all around type lubricant, the Finish Line Wet Lube is marketed for bikes but its' a very nice oil, very light and clean oil, coats the metal well and will not gum if it gets the chance to dry up.

Rust is this weird stuff, it coats surfaces and makes parts fuse stuck with corrotion. When oiled and unstuck; as gears and hinges get's used again rust sort of dissolves, it flushes out like a dust and residue in the oil. I usually get it all off, but it can take time and several rounds with cleaning, scrubbing and oiling. Using the machine regularly is often the best medicine.

This subject is an ongoing thing for me, both when I tend to my bikes and when I take over an old sewing machine.

Finish Line works for me - yes it is thick but I wasn't mad about it in the end. I've only used it where there was real bad rust.

Which bottle did you get? I have used two different types, and their grease , but the one I like for sewing machines is light running oil, with "nano particle teflon and boron nitride", totally within regular sewing machine oil viscosity, lighter than the original Singer oil. It's a clear transparent bottle with gold screw-on top and a bit of gold on the sticker, other wise the same recognisable logo; "Finish Line Ceramic Wet Chain Lube". The lubricant it's self is more of a milky white liquid, or opaque white. I have the TriFlow bottle right next to it ;- )

Miriam,

You got a link to this "Finish Line" stuff????


Joe

The stuff I got was green.

I just go to the bike store.....

Yeah, the green one is their heaviest oil, to stand up to all kinds of wet and salty conditions. The gold bottle is the super smooth one, with teflon and nano particle what-not, it's not the same. If you ever get a bottle of their stuff again, go for the gold bottle ;) It's not a big deal though.

I think the original Singer oil must have been something like SAE 15, maybe 10. I have bought very basic generic SAE oil 10 and it was lighter than Singers. The old oil wasn't completly clear and transparent, it had more of a amber color. I think what they sell these days is completely clear and colorless, at least some, I suspect a bit lighter. It's hard to compare basic mineral oil with their synthetic versions, since the syntetic types tend to be a bit gel like in their viscosity. Some heavy duty chain oils for bikes would be horror in a sewing machine, the very basic ones are often spot on the origial Singer oil. I just go on and on here, but I go for the light synthetic versions with teflon.

After a week and a half with the flu I'm getting back on my 31-15. I couldn't find a better thread to ask about it than this one, so excuse me for hijacking the thread. I have my machine working very freely aqnd timing looks to be pretty much ok. I haven't tried sewing yet as I've taken the table apart and I'm also waiting for a new tensioner to get here. The think I'm needing help with now is the motor clutch. I have one of the older clutch's with the 3 motor pulleys and a beveled pusher that push's the three pulleys against the machine pulley. I don't think it is adjusted just right and it is hard to get the clutch to disengage. Are there any threads on the group that get into adjusting clutches are anyone that has experience in this area.

Do I really need to start a thread for my 31-15 machine are is jumping on other 31-15 threads acceptable.
Dave

Dave, you are just fine. I have not seen a 3 belt clutch. Mine all have only had one belt. Pictures?
Where is CD? If you pm him he might know more than anybody else around here on that one.

Thanks Miriam, I think I will post a few pictures and PM CD with a link to the post.

Well Miriam, I haven't got a reply from CD so I'm asking if anyone else has had any dealings with this type clutch. I'm thinking of taking it apart to clean and see what I can find out about why the clutch is so tight. I'm open to any suggestion before I take it apart.
Thanks
David Hair

It looks like it has to do with speed. I wonder if it was on a line of machines all driven by one motor? CD left. I think he went over to the new Victorian sweat shop forum check with SteveH for a link. If it were mine I would clean off dried up oil and re-oil. Test and see what it does.

Miriam,

From the way the motor was mounted to the table top I also think it may have been line driven. Even though it had a Singer motor the way it was mounted was to say the least hap hazard mount, not a factory job.
David

I too have a clutch motor like that on the first industrial machine I bought. It is the best clutch motor for control. The machine is from a factory my uncle worked in and he brought it home for my aunt. Not sure but I think the handy work is done by my aunt after uncle died. I have the three pulley's attached to the table and the motor is attached to the 2x4 on the base. Machine belt on the machine is on the largest pulley and the clutch motor belt is to the middle. If you need pictures let me know. This is the only one that was set up that way but as I said, the best one with clutch motor for control. Good Luck!
Lisa

Lisa,

Do you know if there is a clutch pad or if the clutch is metal to metal.

David