Singer Lubricant - aka - Grease
 

Does anyone know of a source for Singer Lubricant in Canada. I can find it in the USA at various sources, but shipping makes it prohibitive. I don't have a pay pal account. May have to break down and get one.

Thanks in advance

it is my understanding you can also use Vaseline. although I am not sure how to actually get the Vaseline in the hole.

I don't have a source of the Singer Motor Lube any more. From what I have read that lube has been discontinued by Singer and what you find now ( the white stuff ) is for gears, not motors.

To use petroleum jelly go to Sew-Classic or a craft / hobby store and buy one of the syringes with the long curved tube on the end. Pop the plunger out and fill it with petroleum jelly then put the plunger back in. You'll need to cut the tip off the curved end so it will just fit inside the motor grease tube. Insert and inject.
I keep two of those syringes, one with Singer lube - eventually will have p-j, and the other with T-F grease. They are very handy.

Here's the Sew-Classic link so you'll know what I'm talking about:
{ http://www.shop.sew-classic.com/Syri...e-SCSMJ412.htm }

Joe

Try this source for syringes.
 

In Canada (and also USA) try Lee Valley:

http://www.leevalley.com/en/wood/pag...at=1,110,42967

The needle syringes are great for oil. If you use them without the needle, good for grease.

The non-needle syrgines are also greast for oil. And if you clip the curved tip, to biggen the hole, they become great for grease also.

Happy lubing,

-Cecilia

You can use Tri-Flow sewing machine grease. I bought a tube for my vintage machines. I also use Tri-Flow oil in all of my machines that need oil. I use it on the ratchets on my frame. When I first starting frame quilting, the ratchets were so bad that I was afraid that I was going to break them every time I needed to move the quilt sandwich. I called Grace and they shipped me new ratchets. But before they arrived, I found Tri-Flow. I used it on my ratchets. They worked perfectly. Once a year or so, I respray them. I still have the replacement ratchets in the drawer, never used them. I wouldn't use anything else. Love it.

You can find it at bike shops. Here is the link to sew-classic that tells about the Tri-Flow products.
http://shop.sew-classic.com/4-Oil-Grease-Tools_c6.htm

In Canada, you can get syringes and/or needles of various sorts at TSC, meant for animal injections sort of thing. Quite cheap and a TSC store may be closer than Lee Valley, which is also one of my favourite stores!
Nova Sewing in Hamilton Ontario used to have that lubricant, you could maybe contact them to see what they may have or recommend. They have a website too, novasewing.com

I buy mine on ebay....

Please don't use the Tri-flo grease in the motor.

Cecilia S., the set of 5 needle syringes at Lee Valley would be perfect for applying Elmers glue to keep our binding in place for stitching. Thanks for letting us know, wonder if Harbor Freight has such things.

Elmer's Glue?!? Binding? Do tell!!!
 

Elmer's glue, really?

Okay, so here's the thing. I am a totaly novice at all of this; tinkering, sewing. I've successfully, thusfar, sewn mittens and rectangles. Period. So forgive me if I am asking for clarification on something which to you may be obvious...

You use Elmer's glue to hold stuff in place? Hmmmm. Do you let it fully dry first? Do you sew through it?

The only experience I have sewing through anything gluey is when I got creative and sewed through an envelope which had a sticker on it. Gummed the daylights out of the needle.

So, I would love to know more about how you do this successfully. I will -very soon- be starting to learn more about sewing, and so anything you can tell me about this glue things would be helpful.

As for the syringes, Lee Valley also has a US site, and also, I think it was Joe who posted a US site with syringes, in this thread, just before I posted my link; those syringes were very similar.

-C

I should have clarified that it is not to be used in the grease tubes. However, it is great for the gears.

Thank you everyone for your help. I've looked for Tri-flow here and can get the oil, but not the grease. I've been told and read NOT to use vasoline. I don't remember why, but will look it up again. I will try a couple of your suggested sites.

Overlander,

Some older machines actually specify petroleum jelly ( Vaseline) as the lube for their motors. Others call for their factory supplied lube, Singer for instance.
In this case Singer has defected out on us and no longer sells the motor lube. As far as I have read the closest grease to use is petroleum jelly.

That is why I have mentioned it. Hopefully somewhere there is a grease that's more like the Singer grease than petroleum jelly.

Joe

Thanks Joe. I am hopeful that I will find some grease, but if all else fails I will try the petroleum jelly. :)

Joe. I have a FW and a 15-91 manuals for both say to use motor lube. If I use Vaseline do you just pump until it starts to seep out or is there an amount. I don't see anything in the manual other than motor needs lubed. Also how often does it need to be done? Probably depends on usage I would imagine. Can you tell by the sound of the motor when it needs lube? Does it whine? does it get sluggish or pull harder? Now my FW has a tube of lube that appears to still be soft. Do I dare use that?

[QUOTE=J Miller;6239318]I don't have a source of the Singer Motor Lube any more. From what I have read that lube has been discontinued by Singer and what you find now ( the white stuff ) is for gears, not motors.

Joe, the Singer Lubricant I got last year at Joann's is clear, not white. Is it just the white that isn't good for the motors, or should I not use the clear Singer Lubricant in my motors?
Janis

oreo,

No, don't push it in till it comes out, that's too much. Just fill the little cup. Remember as it gets warm from the motor running it gets soft and flows to the bearings. You don't want too much, that can contaminate the armature and brushes.
Follow the lube instructions in your owners manual.

Janis,
You got the motor lube. The white stuff has a different part number and is for the gears. The clear stuff is for the motors and can be used on the gears.
The JoAnns around here discontinued Singer grease about 3 years ago when they closed out the two smaller stores and opened the one huge one.

Joe

Question regarding the TriFlo lubricant - why did you say not to use it on the motor? I thought I was the replacement for the Singer lubricant.

About the glue. Go to youtube, put in elmer's glue. Her name is Susan Shumacher(spelling?). It is the school glue that I and others use. I hold the binding down and set the glue with my iron. It flakes, no gummy stuff on the needle. It washes right out, doesn't stain, and makes it possible to quickly sew an accurate binding. The stuff is really just thick starch, completely non toxic.

I'm sorry I missed this. Overlander and I have been talking. The last order I put in to my supplier resulted in the brown grease, all of the tubes I've opened anyway. I'm shipping a couple of tubes her way, and I can help out anyone else in Canada who's having trouble finding it.

This has been said many times, but here it is again; that which makes the Tri-Flow grease great for gears is the same thing that makes it unsuitable for motors. It is synthetic and does not get soft and flow when warm. Singer motor lube and petroleum jelly gets soft and flows as it gets warm.

Please make a note of this ..... :)

Joe

Joe, I've had a chat with my supplier up here, they contacted their supplier (i assume "down there") and had this to say:

"The blue/yellow package sounds like an old package we used to sell under the Simplicity brand but none of our current package is blue/yellow.

AND
This item was not reformulated; however, we were having issues with cold weather so we are now purchasing the product from a new source."

I asked about the several different packages I was seeing, including a "current" blue and yellow one on some site (can't recall which)

So, at the supplier level, no one "knows" it's discontinued.
Some retailers are getting some "Weird" tubes
Some of the product is having freezing issues(?) I assume that's what cold weather means?

I'm wondering if the perceived shortage is at the retail level. I currently have access to 180 tubes. And that's til the next order comes in at my supplier....

ETA: Just read this in another group:

"Petroleum jelly is highly flammable and should not be used near any source of wiring or electricity. As an RN, I was taught never to place petroleum jelly on the nostrils of a patient with a nasal cannula, or mask, do to the risk of flammability with oxygen. Please don't use Vaseline to lube any electric sewing machine!"

Uhh... I didn't even think to check it for flammability... thoughts? SC, the Vintage Singer Group, and many others suggest it...

I've found it in the Simplicity blue and yellow package at JoAnn.com, but most of the stores don't carry it.
As a nurse I was also taught not to use petroleum jelly with oxygen. Still- I've never heard of a sewing machine fire. Has anyone?

Not specifically... though with some of the wiring, I'm not sure how they haven't gone up more often.
Joe did have a smoker at one point....

Thinking about that a little more.... what's to burn in a motor? wire insulation. It would be pretty contained for lack of fuel to burn. The amount of Vaseline is pretty tiny, it would probably smoke, maybe flare a touch.. then what?

ETA: The biggest problem would be if it managed to escape the motor and get some fabric.

Now irons on the other hand. I've read some horror stories here on the QB about irons...

I know this will sound flippant, and I don't mean it to, honestly; but, I am pretty sure that the nurse training would also advise you not to put Singer Lube in the patient's nostrils.

I am pretty sure Singer Lube is also a petroleum product.

Now, I am just repeating what someone else told me, but the source is a VerySmartPerson who has worked professionally with machines. He tested a blop of Singer Lube and a blop of Vaseline under heat. He said that they both melted at the very same temperature, which was approx 115 degrees. He also said that left on the paper, both blobs stained/crawled/migrated at exactly the same rate over two days.

That's good enough for me; I would not hesitate to use Vaseline.

(On the nurse topic, the VSP cutely told me that if my sewing machine was sick, I could also try Vapo-Rub on the old stitcher...) :)

As a pharmacist I use petroleum jelly (Vaseline) for many lubricating purposes - pool pump lids, gears, hand cream, and many others. Any hydrocarbon will burn. The volatility is a factor determining at what temp it will ignite. Re: gas/volatile, kerosene/less volatile, grease/less volatile. I'm not afraid to use petroleum jelly on SM gears. Theoretically, pet jelly won't conduct electricity, so near use would not be my concern. Pet jelly not to be used on mucus membranes is due to the aqueous/hydrocarbon mixture is a great growth mix for bacteria. I don't use pet jelly on any mucus membranes for that reason, but, sewing machine gears, what the hey?

VapoRub is pet jelly with menthol and eucalyptus oils added. VapoRub would be a good emergency SM lube.��

Thank you Tammi. I'm looking forward to 'greasing' my FW and my mother's treadle so they will run a little smoother. They are both VERY dry and I don't want to use them till I can grease them. I have oiled all the little holes that require it, but the motor on the FW could use some and the gears under the body of the treadle also. Can hardly wait till it arrives. :)

Some very interesting replies from this thread. You learn so much from this site. :)

Tammi,

I sincerely doubt the flammability of petroleum jelly in sewing machine motors. I call that BS.

As to the Singer grease not being reformulated, I'm going to stick my neck out and say those that say that are mistaken.
I have many tubes of the old lube. And one tube of the new stuff.
They are a different color, old is anywhere from opaque to amber, the new is white like lithium grease.
The textures are different. They spread different. The point is, they are totally different.

If Singer is having freezing problems with the lube they need to address that, but why would sewing machine grease freeze? It's cold here in IL in the winter too and I've never had a bit of trouble with the Singer grease, old or new freezing.
But then I don't sew outside in the snow either.

I don't know, it just sounds to me like your supplier is making up stories to try and make a sale.

Joe

This is the same thing I read on a blog. Unfortunately I do not know which blog as I lost those book marks when my last computer failed.
Motors have used petroleum based lubes for over a hundred years and they still do. If it was a fire hazard then there would have been a different lube used.
You also use petroleum based oils in your car and you know how hot that engine gets. And yet, there's no problem.

Yeah, I call the fire hazard with petroleum jelly on sewing machine motors BS.

Joe

Yes I do have one that smokes. A real pretty blue clone. I don't know exactly what is smoking inside the motor. I've used q-tips and denatured alcohol to clean the commutator and brushes, (without disassembling the motor - you can access them from out side) and yet it continues to blow a puff of smoke as you start sewing.

I have not yet taken the motor apart as it runs so good. I suspect it has been over oiled at some point and the armature has become oil saturated near the brushes.
I think that in due time it will burn off all the oil and quit smoking. I just need to use it enough to do that.
I seriously doubt there is any fire hazard to it at all.

Joe

I was thinking about the nursing statement this morning more. Oxygen is WAY more flammable than PJ ever will be. Honestly, I think we shouldn't be using pure Oxygen near PJ! Yes, a little flippant as well.

But the fact remains, the PJ isn't going to introduce the spark, and the Oxygen will create the fireball first.

I'm really glad I could help. :) Your treadle irons would probably love the Tri Flow Lube, if we could find it in Canada. An alternative for the irons may be "SuperLube" which is a synthetic grease with PTFE (Teflon) added as well. The Singer Lube is only strictly necessary in the motor, everywhere else you're good with the other stuff.

I don't think my supplier is making stories up. Their supplier might be, but they, as in both companies must be aware that the shipment is coming back if it turns out not to be true. My supplier is very good about taking things back, or crediting me if the item is not as described. It helps that my rep and I discuss computers as only 2 geeks can. ;) The last shipment I got, in November, was the right stuff. The 180 tubes I have access to are part of the same shipment from their supplier. Their supplier says that it's not reformulated, so I will order a "box" of the new as well, and see what it looks and feels like.

I have a sneaking suspicion that there's more than one manufacturer of the stuff, and at least one is not staying true to the original formula. The blue and yellow package is supposedly "old" packaging, but I've seen it on at least one site as the new packaging. I also suspect it might not be "Singer" who's manufacturing it, more that it's licensed to someone.

It was my assumption that they were inferring that it was freezing. I wonder if it's a separation issue or something else. It's possible they're getting it from somewhere that it freezes in transit. Perhaps there's too much water in the formulation, maybe it "Gels" and changes when it freezes / gets cold, etc. I don't know. I'm not a chemist. Heck, I failed chemistry in Grade 11. ;)

The famed and often recommended NM has things on her page about PJ. Perhaps that's where you read it. The more I thought about it, the more I thought, uhhh...no, but I thought it was worth putting it out there or discussion ;)

Probably not. Things coated in grease tend to have a harder time lighting ;) Out of curiosity, what color are the sparks on the commutator? White/blue or something else?

Thinking (still more) on this topic, I have a 2 stroke dirtbike. (oil and fuel mixed together in the gas tank for the uninitiated - not you Joe. ;) )

We bought it new in 2004. It's never started right until this year. I've fought with it for 9 years, and was close to giving up riding. I had the air mixture screw out 4 full turns (providing it way more air than it should need to run) just to get it to start. It was rejetted for planet earth (previously I think it may have been fit for Pluto or possibly Mercury.), the air filter spotlessly clean, etc. Besides not starting there's always a trail of sludge that comes out the tail pipe. DH likes to have the same fuel in both bikes for ease of use. His is a different brand though. But a dirt bike is a dirt bike, right? Not with fuel mixtures. Mine gets extremely upset when the fuel has too much oil in the fuel mixture. It simply won't light and I kick and kick and kick and... well you know. Then I need a nap before I can ride down the trail. We lowered the amount of oil in the gas and you know what? It starts first good kick, or second wimpy kick. Add to that, there's no grease slick you can use to track me through the bush anymore.

So. Speaking to the volatility of different petroleum products.... oil and grease may help prevent fires.... it sure did in my bike. LOL! No, ... that's not going to be my official position on this. ;)

Petroleum jelly is not use as a lubricant inside of the motor, where all of the electrical magic takes place, but rather outside of the motor, to lubricate each end of the shaft that runs through the center of the motor.

I guess it is possible that some seals could fail, thereby allowing some petroleum jelly into the motor body, but at that point, your problems go beyond what type of lubricant was used.

So for clarification purposes I'm going to ask if the couple of squirts of triflow lube I put in the ends of my FW motor are a problem? It seemed to run better after I did it (first time I'd found any since I bought the machine a few years ago). I had located oil early on and do that fairly often - every couple months most of the time. This time I had the lube and used it as well.
I guess I'm not mechanically savey enough to understand why the Triflow lube isn't great for the motor since it seemed to help. And I'm another that chemistry wasn't my best subject. Lol!

I'm assuming you put it in the grease tubes here.
Personally, I would remove it, only because (and I think that this was discussed earlier in the thread) the melting point of the synthetic grease that TriFlow Lube is uh... well, it doesn't. (Just looked it up, it's advertised as a "non melting" lube)
PJ and Singer lube both melt at 115 degrees. We -want- the lube to melt a little, right where it's making contact with the heat from the bearing. This is what provides the lubrication. It's like a candle stick. A candle stick won't flow into anything in its normal state. Add heat and it's all over the place if you don't contain it. This is the main reason for the grease tubes not having oil in them, but instead a grease that melts just a little and flows into where we want it, when we want it.

Practical chemistry makes a lot more sense to me than memorizing the periodic table. ;) We use practical chemistry all the time in our homes though - starting our cars, cooking dinner, baking especially, all sorts of ways, and we don't have to know about the elements and how molecules join. Only that vinegar and baking soda isn't likely to keep the kitchen clean, etc.

Tammi,

I think the sparks from the commutator are mostly white with some red in them. Not sure though .... I've got a couple of videos of it, wait right here and I'll go watch a video. Maybe I can see something.

Oh well, now I can't find the stupid things. I'll keep looking.

Joe

Red and orange is usually a "dirty" low temperature type of spark, isn't it? Probably some residue of some sort.

OK, I've been meaning to do this for a while but things got in the way.

Here is a pic of the two Singer greases.
[ATTACH=CONFIG]433448[/ATTACH]

On the left is the white grease that at one time Sew-Classic had a notice on. The notice said the white grease was for gears, not motors. If you will look close at the text on the tube you'll see where it says: "Pure non-flowing compound".
This tells me that no matter what the distributors or suppliers or even Singer says, that this white grease is not for the motors.

On the right is the normal Singer Motor Lube we need for our motors. This tube has brown grease in it. Others I have come with a lighter color. Different lots is my theory. It is totally different grease than that in the blue tube.

Also if you'll notice the blue tube is shorter than the red tube, yet both are labeled as containing 1/2 fluid ounce. This tells me the grease in the blue tube is heavier than that in the red tube. Another clue that it is not suitable for the motors.

Joe

Just to add to the confusion, I have an old lead tube of Singer Motor Lubricant, and here is what it says on the back of the tube:

The Lubricant Par Excellence
For High Speed Electrical Machinery

A Pure Non-Flowing Compound
Retaining Its Consistency and Possessing
High Lubricating Qualities

I have some of those old metal tubes too. I'll see if I can unroll one and see what it says. I wonder if there is more than one kind even back then?

Joe