Yes, it *IS* a can of worms... advice? Suggestions?
01-17-2011, 12:02 PM
#21
Super Member
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Western Nevada
Posts: 2,520
As an online shop owner, I'd give the following advice to simplify your life. (take it or leave it)
8 yards in a flat rate envelope is about double what can comfortably fit in those without; a) violating USPS rules, b) costing you a ton of time trying to wrassle that much fabric into them, and c) risking damage to the fabric. A couple of suggestions:
1. There really is no competitive advantage to over-stuffing FRE's, especially when your orders come back as damaged. Cut your maximum yardage for FRE's down, your orders will pack up quicker and you can protect them better, eliminating damage returns and/or complaints.
2. Use 1st class International parcel for your smaller orders, up to 4 pounds (about 12 yards+). It's just as cost effective as FRE's but a lot easier to deal with, the customs papers are simpler and faster, and it takes the same transport as Priority mail does, so it gets there in about the same time. Of course, this may require that you change your cart shipping calculations which takes some setup work. You'll also have to buy your own containers.
Don't sell what you don't have in stock. That eliminates your problem with pre-orders and back-orders. With manufacturers canceling lines right and left nowadays, pre-orders are becoming more problematic, and backorders are always a problem, as you're discovering. If you oversell a fabric, i.e. you have 2 yards in stock and the customer orders three, contact them and ask them if they want the 2 or if they want to cancel. I use skype for international calls to customers, it's cheap and works well, but you do have to check and see what time it is where you're calling before you call.
FWIW... :mrgreen:
8 yards in a flat rate envelope is about double what can comfortably fit in those without; a) violating USPS rules, b) costing you a ton of time trying to wrassle that much fabric into them, and c) risking damage to the fabric. A couple of suggestions:
1. There really is no competitive advantage to over-stuffing FRE's, especially when your orders come back as damaged. Cut your maximum yardage for FRE's down, your orders will pack up quicker and you can protect them better, eliminating damage returns and/or complaints.
2. Use 1st class International parcel for your smaller orders, up to 4 pounds (about 12 yards+). It's just as cost effective as FRE's but a lot easier to deal with, the customs papers are simpler and faster, and it takes the same transport as Priority mail does, so it gets there in about the same time. Of course, this may require that you change your cart shipping calculations which takes some setup work. You'll also have to buy your own containers.
Don't sell what you don't have in stock. That eliminates your problem with pre-orders and back-orders. With manufacturers canceling lines right and left nowadays, pre-orders are becoming more problematic, and backorders are always a problem, as you're discovering. If you oversell a fabric, i.e. you have 2 yards in stock and the customer orders three, contact them and ask them if they want the 2 or if they want to cancel. I use skype for international calls to customers, it's cheap and works well, but you do have to check and see what time it is where you're calling before you call.
FWIW... :mrgreen:
01-17-2011, 12:12 PM
#22
Super Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Orchard Park, NY (near Buffalo, which is near Niagara Falls)
Posts: 3,884
Originally Posted by QKO
As an online shop owner, I'd give the following advice to simplify your life. (take it or leave it)
8 yards in a flat rate envelope is about double what can comfortably fit in those without; a) violating USPS rules, b) costing you a ton of time trying to wrassle that much fabric into them, and c) risking damage to the fabric. A couple of suggestions:
1. There really is no competitive advantage to over-stuffing FRE's, especially when your orders come back as damaged. Cut your maximum yardage for FRE's down, your orders will pack up quicker and you can protect them better, eliminating damage returns and/or complaints.
2. Use 1st class International parcel for your smaller orders, up to 4 pounds (about 12 yards+). It's just as cost effective as FRE's but a lot easier to deal with, the customs papers are simpler and faster, and it takes the same transport as Priority mail does, so it gets there in about the same time. Of course, this may require that you change your cart shipping calculations which takes some setup work. You'll also have to buy your own containers.
Don't sell what you don't have in stock. That eliminates your problem with pre-orders and back-orders. With manufacturers canceling lines right and left nowadays, pre-orders are becoming more problematic, and backorders are always a problem, as you're discovering.
FWIW...
8 yards in a flat rate envelope is about double what can comfortably fit in those without; a) violating USPS rules, b) costing you a ton of time trying to wrassle that much fabric into them, and c) risking damage to the fabric. A couple of suggestions:
1. There really is no competitive advantage to over-stuffing FRE's, especially when your orders come back as damaged. Cut your maximum yardage for FRE's down, your orders will pack up quicker and you can protect them better, eliminating damage returns and/or complaints.
2. Use 1st class International parcel for your smaller orders, up to 4 pounds (about 12 yards+). It's just as cost effective as FRE's but a lot easier to deal with, the customs papers are simpler and faster, and it takes the same transport as Priority mail does, so it gets there in about the same time. Of course, this may require that you change your cart shipping calculations which takes some setup work. You'll also have to buy your own containers.
Don't sell what you don't have in stock. That eliminates your problem with pre-orders and back-orders. With manufacturers canceling lines right and left nowadays, pre-orders are becoming more problematic, and backorders are always a problem, as you're discovering.
FWIW...
I have an official USPS customer service rep stopping by tomorrow morning and I am ever so anxious to ask questions about the limations of FREs (flat-rate-envelopes). This past year we have had only two problems with our fat envelopes (both were problems on the receiving end - not damaged, just "postage due"). So for us, thus far, they are still working even when overstuffed.
I will ask the rep about the First Class International option.
01-17-2011, 12:13 PM
#23
Super Member
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: RVing in USA and Canada
Posts: 1,413
Originally Posted by Favorite Fabrics
Originally Posted by ghostrider
You could follow Hancock's of Paducah's model which is charge full shipping with the initial package, bill the credit card for backordered items only when they have been shipped, and do not charge for additional shipping on backorders. Their international (Canada excluded) shipping rates, however, are figured as a percentage (30%) of the cost of the complete order, not a box size rate. They are also a much larger operation than you are. :lol:
Their $20 minimum shipping cost isn't so customer-friendly to the international shopper who just wants a little bit of fabric, though. Hmmm...
Seems that being "fair" is the hardest thing to do. My thought - the one international response wasn't unhappy paying the $20 minimum shipping. A person who is buying US is still paying less than their home country and they will buy more in the future if happy. If part of the order was "backordered", I'd have the shipping people put a standard piece of paper in stating "part of order on backorder and will be shipped out ASAP". You might even be able to put a smidge of material or something in with the note for being patient. People, women in particular, like little surprises/gifts.
You will always get complaints - some just like to complain. :)
01-17-2011, 12:33 PM
#25
Super Member
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Tasmania, Australia
Posts: 2,016
Originally Posted by sunflower126
I would think that maybe for international orders no backorders. Maybe you could keep a email list to notify them when a backordered fabric comes becomes available. Maybe give them 7-10 days to order before making available to others. Although they would have to pay the postage twice they would have a chance to get the fabrics they want. It's seems like a no win situation for all. Hope you come up with a workable solution. Maybe you'll get some input from the international shoppers about how they feel it could best be handled. Good luck.
01-17-2011, 12:43 PM
#26
Super Member
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 1,029
Maybe I am weird, but I refuse to buy backordered/pre-orders on material. I just don't need it that bad! It kind of annoys me to be at an online fabric shop to put material into my shopping cart only to find out it is not in stock because it is a preorder....
So in your situation, I would say NO to international backorders. It's not only about the postage, but also about the order tracking time. And like someone else mentioned, the timing and possible cancellations by the manufacturer/distributor.
So in your situation, I would say NO to international backorders. It's not only about the postage, but also about the order tracking time. And like someone else mentioned, the timing and possible cancellations by the manufacturer/distributor.
01-17-2011, 01:05 PM
#27
Super Member
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 1,685
As a customer, if I placed an order and some items were in stock and some were pre-orders or back-orders, I would not expect the company to ship me everything for free or for only one shipping charge. If I had placed an order only for back-ordered or pre-ordered items, I would still pay shipping. Some sites give you the option to hold everything until all items are in and can be shipped together or pay for each shipment as it is ready. There is nothing wrong with that.
The way you do it is very nice, but I would never expect it. Whatever you decide, just make sure you clearly state this policy on the website.
The way you do it is very nice, but I would never expect it. Whatever you decide, just make sure you clearly state this policy on the website.
01-17-2011, 01:14 PM
#28
Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: North Carolina
Posts: 745
I like the idea of sending the E mail with the choices and agree that the better you communicate the better things will go. Some international customers have little fabric choices and/or very expensive choices so the additional shipping may be acceptable.
Although we would like to send the entire order to keep the shipping costs down, sometimes that is not possible. Your order of 3 yards of xxx is not in stock, please let us know how you would like us to handle this order.
1: send what we have now and backorder the rest, however, please understand there will be additional shipping charges
2: cut what we have, hold for 10 days and if the rest is not here, we will send what we have and set up a backorder, there will be additional shipping charges for the second shipment
3. cut what we have, hold for 10 days if the rest is not here we will send what we have and there will be no backorder
4. cancel the entire order
If we don't hear from you we will assume you choose method three, please contact us if this is not to your wishes.
If the item(s) is(are) not received by us within the next 30 days the back order will be cancelled and you will be contacted by E Mail.
I would also include in the order that is sent, how the rest of the shipment was handled and refer to the E mail you sent earlier.
Although we would like to send the entire order to keep the shipping costs down, sometimes that is not possible. Your order of 3 yards of xxx is not in stock, please let us know how you would like us to handle this order.
1: send what we have now and backorder the rest, however, please understand there will be additional shipping charges
2: cut what we have, hold for 10 days and if the rest is not here, we will send what we have and set up a backorder, there will be additional shipping charges for the second shipment
3. cut what we have, hold for 10 days if the rest is not here we will send what we have and there will be no backorder
4. cancel the entire order
If we don't hear from you we will assume you choose method three, please contact us if this is not to your wishes.
If the item(s) is(are) not received by us within the next 30 days the back order will be cancelled and you will be contacted by E Mail.
I would also include in the order that is sent, how the rest of the shipment was handled and refer to the E mail you sent earlier.
01-17-2011, 01:21 PM
#29
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Thread Starter
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Orchard Park, NY (near Buffalo, which is near Niagara Falls)
Posts: 3,884
Ncsewer I like the way you have phrased it. And I think we can improve it a little bit still:
1: send what we have now and backorder the rest, however, please understand there will be additional shipping charges. There will also be room in the package for an additional five yards should you need more fabric by then.
How's that?
Originally Posted by ncsewer
Although we would like to send the entire order to keep the shipping costs down, sometimes that is not possible. Your order of 3 yards of xxx is not in stock, please let us know how you would like us to handle this order.
How's that?
01-17-2011, 01:26 PM
#30
Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: North Carolina
Posts: 745
spoken like a true entrepreneur!! There will always be rough spots but if most people can work with this you'll do great.
Originally Posted by Favorite Fabrics
Ncsewer I like the way you have phrased it. And I think we can improve it a little bit still:
1: send what we have now and backorder the rest, however, please understand there will be additional shipping charges. There will also be room in the package for an additional five yards should you need more fabric by then.
How's that?
Originally Posted by ncsewer
Although we would like to send the entire order to keep the shipping costs down, sometimes that is not possible. Your order of 3 yards of xxx is not in stock, please let us know how you would like us to handle this order.
How's that?
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