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Thread: Here's how to fix "moving needlebar during bobbin winding" problem

  1. #1
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    Here's how to fix "moving needlebar during bobbin winding" problem

    Muv and Schuu6p, I've finally got a tutorial up on how to fix the problem of when the needlebar still moves during bobbin-winding mode. Sorry for the delay, but it took me a lot of tries to get the video, audio and editing right.

    http://vssmb.blogspot.com/2012/06/ho...om-moving.html

    To make it intelligible, I tried to tone down my regional accent--Muv, you speak the Queen's English as in Elizabeth, I speak it as in Brooklyn-Queens Expressway. But in reviewing the video I see I've failed to slow my speech down, a common complaint from my out-of-town and foreign friends. If anyone has trouble understanding me or keeping up with my caffeinated pace, let me know and I'll see about creating a more reasonably-paced video.

    My chief gripe with instructional videos is that they're often too dark for me to see. I may have overcompensated here by overexposing the video. Is it too bright?

    I'd appreciate any constructive feedback anyone has on how I can make this video, or more like it in the future, better or easier for everyone to follow.
    - Rain

    Vintage Singer Sewing Machine Blog
    http://vssmb.blogspot.com/

  2. #2
    Super Member Charlee's Avatar
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    I think they are great videos Rain, and since for now I'm deaf in my right ear (allergies or something), I sometimes have trouble hearing/knowing what folks are saying... I didn't have a bit of trouble understanding every word you said!
    One day, you'll only be a memory for some people. Do your best to be a good one.

    http://charleeturner.blogspot.com

  3. #3
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    Sorry to hear about your right ear Charlee, I hope it clears up!

    It's a relief to hear the audio is okay. I finally figured out that I could wear an iPhone headset plugged into an iPod Nano to record the sound separately at a decent volume. My other gripe about instructional videos is that the sound is often too low, so I crank my speakers up all the way--then I'll suddenly get a SUPER LOUD e-mail alert and almost spit my coffee out.
    - Rain

    Vintage Singer Sewing Machine Blog
    http://vssmb.blogspot.com/

  4. #4
    Muv
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    Hello Rain, I've already left you a message on the other thread where you posted the link. The videos are excellent. I've dashed straight across to have another go at my 15K but the blighter still won't play the game. It has the old fashioned washer with three ears.

    It's OK Rain, I've seen enough Top Cat cartoons to be able to understand you.

    I'm a long way from Queen's English. Wrong part of the country and wrong class.

  5. #5
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    How frustrating! Even after the takeup-lever trick? I've never had this not work, even on machines in rough condition.

    If there wasn't the little matter of the Atlantic Ocean, I'd be happy to work your machine over until the problem was gone. If you have more than one 15K, may I suggest swapping out some of the parts to see if the problem can be isolated?

    Touche on the Top Cat. Despite tearing through Downton Abbey, Upstairs/Downstairs, Sherlock, Karl Pilkington, Victorian Farm and even physically driving from Glasgow to London, I'm still not able to distinguish most British accents beyond the big obvious regions.

    I thought about doing one NYC-viewer-specific demo video with full-blown accent cranked up to 10. It would be fun to demonstrate the entire procedure in 30 seconds flat.
    - Rain

    Vintage Singer Sewing Machine Blog
    http://vssmb.blogspot.com/

  6. #6
    Muv
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    No, not even after holding down the take up lever.

    30 second vids with accent at full throttle are a dead cert for cult viewing. Consider me a fan in advance.

  7. #7
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    Okay Muv, I've just spent 20 minutes staring at my machine trying to figure out what the problem could be with yours. If you have time, let's attack this one step at a time.

    1. Turn the stop motion wheel to bobbin winding mode. Now inspect the set screw in the stop motion wheel, on the inside. Is the tip of the set screw coming into contact with the washer? Are you able to get a playing card or scrap of paper between the tip of the set screw and the washer?

    2. If your machine is belt-driven, remove the belt. Turn the stop motion wheel to bobbin winding mode. Turning the handwheel manually, is the problem still in evidence?

    3. Remove the stop motion wheel, the washer, and the handwheel. Lay the handwheel on the table, standing up as if the handwheel itself was a little table. Now lay the washer into its "bed." Rotate the washer with your finger. Does the washer rotate freely and smoothly?

    4. Place the handwheel back on the shaft, and slide it firmly into place as far as it can go. When it stops, do you hear a clean "CLUNK" of metal-on-metal? Or is the sound adulterated, like metal hitting mud?

    We will get to the bottom of this.
    - Rain

    Vintage Singer Sewing Machine Blog
    http://vssmb.blogspot.com/

  8. #8
    Muv
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    Rain - tomorrow. Way past my bedtime

    It's not just the 15K. The gorgeous Serata treadle is stubborn too, but what do you expect from a 99 year old?

    Good night. I shall dream of balance wheels.

  9. #9
    Power Poster miriam's Avatar
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    VERY well done!
    NEVER let a sewing machine know you are in a hurry.

  10. #10
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    I'm from E Iowa and didn't think you had much of an accent at all. Can't wait to work on my machines. The videos were very easy to follow. DH and I also like to know how things work so appreciate extra info in video 1. We give them 5 stars. Hope someone is able to come up with some way to do something about rewiring someday.
    Cheryl Robinson
    http://www.silverneedlestitching.com
    APQS Millenium Longarm with Intelliquilter

  11. #11
    Super Member sweet's Avatar
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    I really enjoyed watching this. I may try this on my old Kenmore. Thanks for all your effort in making this.

  12. #12
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    Cheryl, I'd previously put together an extensive series on how to re-wire a potted motor here:

    http://vssmb.blogspot.com/2012/01/co...ted-motor.html

    It uses mostly still photographs rather than video, because a) shooting video of the extensive procedures covered would be prohibitively time-intensive, and b) with longer, more involved stuff like re-wiring, I think still photographs might actually be better, so you can follow along at your own pace.

    If there's enough demand I may one day attempt to video a re-wiring, but I'll likely have to acquire some specific types of lighting and a camera with a very shallow depth of focus, neither of which are in the budget right now.
    - Rain

    Vintage Singer Sewing Machine Blog
    http://vssmb.blogspot.com/

  13. #13
    Super Member vintagemotif's Avatar
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    Rain, Thank you for posting this excellent tutorial! I wish you had this video posted 2 years ago when I started collecting. I had to learn the hard way; and even then, I didn't think about marking the shafts with the dots. I loved the"x ray" section of the tute, very well done. I enjoy you helpful post. I was through following your tute on removing the 201 bobbin case to clean that area up, I was able to do this simple task. Thanks!!!!

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    Muv, please disregard steps 1, 3 and 4 from message #7 in this thread, and just try step 2 when you have time. I'm messing around with a machine right now and I *think* I may have found what ails yours.
    - Rain

    Vintage Singer Sewing Machine Blog
    http://vssmb.blogspot.com/

  15. #15
    Muv
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    Rain,

    I think you can save yourself the air fare. I have had fun with the screw driver this afternoon.

    You will be pleased to hear that the 15K is now fixed. All it needed was oil on the shaft, and I feel a bit of a dimwit about not getting it sorted before now.

    No joy with the Serata yet. It has nearly a century of black muck welding the balance wheel to the shaft so I can't get it off to clean and oil it. I'm inclined just to leave it as it is. What is interesting though is that there is a lubrication hole in the balance wheel to take the oil straight to the right place, whereas with Singers you have to take the wheel off if you want to reach that spot. Very clever, the Germans. One of these days I might do a video about pre-War German bobbin winders. They are in a class of their own.

    Talking about clever Germans, I have two machines, the Little Vesta and a Frister and Rossmann transverse shuttle, that disconnect the motion with a much simpler mechanism, so you have no wretched stop motion screw to contend with. Want to see pics?

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    Senior Member harrishs's Avatar
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    Thank you so much!!!! You are my "learn something new every day"

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    Suh-weet, Muv, that's a relief! About the 15K, I mean. I'd never heard of a Serata; I'd have guessed it was a small city car that gets excellent mileage.

    German design and engineering is thoroughly astonishing. I learned this both at design school and while researching articles I've had to write for work, like this one I'll link to below. It will admittedly only be interesting to a minority of people, as it's about the industrial design of a German gas can--the "Jerry can"--from the 1930s:

    http://bit.ly/c3s00o

    In any case, Muv, would love to see pics.
    - Rain

    Vintage Singer Sewing Machine Blog
    http://vssmb.blogspot.com/

  18. #18
    Muv
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    Hello Rain, The Serata is the treadle on my "How to Treadle" video. It was manufactured by Bernhard Stoewer in Stettin. You will probably enjoy the website www.stoewer-museum.de

    My husband has just walked in so I am showing him the jerry can article - it's just up his street.

    I think I could start a whole new thread - Ingenious Features on Vintage German Machines. Interested?

  19. #19
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    Hi Muv, my chosen area of focus is Singers; so while I'd have nothing to contribute, I'd certainly be interested to see such a thread!
    - Rain

    Vintage Singer Sewing Machine Blog
    http://vssmb.blogspot.com/

  20. #20
    Power Poster miriam's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Muv View Post
    Hello Rain, The Serata is the treadle on my "How to Treadle" video. It was manufactured by Bernhard Stoewer in Stettin. You will probably enjoy the website www.stoewer-museum.de

    My husband has just walked in so I am showing him the jerry can article - it's just up his street.

    I think I could start a whole new thread - Ingenious Features on Vintage German Machines. Interested?
    I'd like it too! And my husband liked the jerry can article too
    NEVER let a sewing machine know you are in a hurry.

  21. #21
    Super Member J Miller's Avatar
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    Rain,
    Watched the first video yesterday, pretty darn good. I'd never seen the hand wheel taken off a 201 before. I'm used to the three finger washer. The 201 looks like the one in our 410A.
    I've got the second video loading now, but at 11:09 I probably won't get to watch it all. I'm on dial up and it will take the rest of the morning to download.



    Muv,

    A suggestion for your Serata. Turn the hand wheel till the oil hole is up then pour in either (if you can get it) Hoppe's #9 gun solvent or a 50-50 mix of ATF and Acetone. Use an eye dropper and just put in a wee bit at a time.
    The Hoppe's is mostly kerosene but will dissolve that old gunked up oil. The ATF/Acetone makes a wonderful penetrating oil. Stinks though and you'd have to make it yourself, but it does work.


    Joe
    Last edited by J Miller; 06-08-2012 at 05:22 AM.

  22. #22
    Muv
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    Joe, don't forget that I am in England and that what you have there isn't necessarily the same as we have here. If I walked into our local hardware shop and asked for gun solvent I would get some rather strange looks.

    I have already fed WD40 down the lubrication hole, I have yet to try a bit of paraffin, and I have already tried the hair dryer trick to try and get a bit of metal expansion. No joy yet. It can wait, I'm not going to bust my buttons over it.

  23. #23
    Power Poster miriam's Avatar
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    paraffin??? what would that do?
    NEVER let a sewing machine know you are in a hurry.

  24. #24
    Super Member J Miller's Avatar
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    Muv,

    Understood on the Hoppe's. There's got to be a penetrating oil product you can get in the UK that would work.

    Joe

  25. #25
    Muv
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    Quote Originally Posted by miriam View Post
    paraffin??? what would that do?
    Nothing, probably.

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