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Thread: Did anyone else read this in McCall's mag

  1. #26
    Super Member Friendly Quilter's Avatar
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    I agree, why do we even buy patterns , Quilt Books or Quilt Mag. if we by law can not show, share or even in some cases give away or sell the quilts we maked from all these sorces. So many of the patterns come from blocks that are grandmothers and there grandmothers used. I could go on for ever on this but I will not.

  2. #27
    Power Poster Lacelady's Avatar
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    So could I or couldn't I put my Jane Stickle reproduction quilt in a show without the wrath of whoever coming down on me? And if I could, what information should I put with it?

  3. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lacelady
    So could I or couldn't I put my Jane Stickle reproduction quilt in a show without the wrath of whoever coming down on me? And if I could, what information should I put with it?
    That's a good question! Many of those blocks are very old patterns and are in the public domain.

    If these blocks were rearranged in a different order/placement and in different colors would that be considered infringement? Would permission be required because they were gathered and put in a book? Can someone claim ownership to a block in the public domain because they put it in a book?

    For example, there are lots of Log Cabin designs that have been used by many Designers who have then published a book. Do they each claim right to that pattern? If I make a Log Cabin quilt and display it or sell it, do I have to contact the multitude of people who have published the Log Cabin block for permission even though it is in the public domain? I probably would not.

    With the DJ, I guess if you call it a Baby Jane or DJ with reference to the book, you probably do have to get permission. If you call it something else and have changed the layout, colors, used EQ to plan your quilt and some of the blocks/design who knows?

  4. #29
    Super Member mom-6's Avatar
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    If it's a kit or a pattern that you followed to the letter, then that's one thing, but once you start doing your own thing with it, how can anyone claim copyright? I rarely buy patterns and even more rarely actually follow them. Somehow or other mine is not going to look just like the pattern.

    Then again I see pictures of all sorts of quilts and totes and eventually one I've made is most likely going to be pretty much like one somebody else made using some pattern, even though I just did my own thing.

    So it becomes a real conundrum.

  5. #30
    Power Poster ckcowl's Avatar
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    copy right laws are laws and do hold up in court rooms, so, maybe just maybe, you should make it a practice, if you want to display your work in public places make sure you either #1. ask permission from whom ever the design belongs to, or #2. make sure your work is original.
    if you notice in that same article it does tell you you can sell the quilt, you can give it away, you can keep it, you just have to ask first if you are going to display it anywhere public. it is the same for any copyrighted item; there is no point in being all upset about it, just learn the law and live with it. it has nothing to do with quilt police, it has to do with THE UNITED STATES COPYRIGHT OFFICE.

  6. #31
    Power Poster ckcowl's Avatar
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    patterns that are in public domain can be used by anyone for any purpose they want. there is a difference between using common blocks and using someones quilt design. it is what you do with the blocks you make that makes all the difference. there are tons of quilt designs that everyone uses, like log cabin block layouts; barn raising...it is when a person does something totally different and claims it as their own then chooses to share the pattern that the problem seems to come up. when you buy that pattern and make it 'their' way it is still 'their' design, you have to get their permission to show it, you can not 'share' the pattern/design...if your friend wants to make one too she has to buy her own pattern...

  7. #32
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    Scissor Queen is absolutely correct. Designers cannot tell you what to do with the finished objects made from their patterns. You can even sell them.

    There was a big to-do about this on a very popular yarn crafts forum that included an official statement from the US copyright office. It's different in other countries, but in the US copyright only protects the pattern (i.e. you can't drop it during a ticker tape parade or try to sell the pattern as your own). But it does not carry over to the object you make from the pattern.

    However, there are those who have a vested interest in making people think differently (ever seen the phrase "for personal use only"?).

  8. #33
    Super Member peaceandjoy's Avatar
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    So... What about the pictures that are displayed here? This is a public forum, does that mean that those pictures are a violation?

  9. #34
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    Ok, so here's what I'm thinking, and what I've seen posted on machine embroidery sites:
    The Pattern itself is indeed copyrighted by the designer who came up with it.
    The Product of the pattern is not "a design" and therefore is not copyrighted.
    Correct, we cannot reproduce the Pattern and sell/display/give away/distribute,
    but we can do as we like with the Product we make from the pattern.

  10. #35
    Super Member kristen0112's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BellaBoo
    Money talks. I dropped all quilt magazine subscriptions that did not allow a pattern in their magazine to be displayed after I make it. I don't buy quilt patterns that state do not display or sell the quilt you made from this pattern. I buy quilt books for the instructions how to make a pattern. Instructions are legal to use how you want but you can't copy the pages. EQ7 takes the place of all patterns so it's worth buying and learning. I don't mind at all spending my money on fabric instead of designer patterns.
    I have to agree with this. MONEY TALKS. We should stop buying quilt magazines that don't allow us to display or sell what we've made from a pattern purchased in their publication. One more reason to add to my list of why I should buy EQ7.

  11. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by peaceandjoy
    So... What about the pictures that are displayed here? This is a public forum, does that mean that those pictures are a violation?
    Another part of a good question.

    The pictures of anything are the property of the person who took the picture.

    But if you (meaning anyone in general) say for instance took a picture of someone else's pattern, you would have violated the designer's rights. Unless you had their permission of course.

    If you post your own picture of your own work, you are good to go.

    But if you post a picture from a magazine or someone else's website or the cover of a pattern or book, that's a violation -

    Meaning, "If it ain't yours, it's someone else's."

    But note: We post and share pictures of quilt shows all the time. No one objects.
    I have seen entries at quilt shows where they won't allow pictures taken of their quilt on display. I understand this, but it's a sure thing that with phone cameras, etc, there are pictures taken of Everything All The Time Everywhere regardless of what the quilt owner says.

    If it's on show in any manner, it will be photo'd and sent around.

  12. #37
    Super Member kristen0112's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by texas granny
    Quote Originally Posted by LindaR
    the question was: can I enter a quilt I made from a McCalls mag or other mag in quilt show?

    Answer: a quilt show is a public display and therefore only the designer can enter the quilt However you can ask permission. the magazine owns or shares the copyright and should be approached for permission.

    I can't believe this, talk about quilt police...our guild has a local quilt show and wouldn't be displaying anything if this was the correct procedure....unbelieveable
    I just bought the new McCalls mag. today They have a story about copy right 101 in the mag. It will answer all you question.
    FYI - That's where this question came from

  13. #38
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    If, as McCalls asserts in this recent article, copyright restrictions are what Mccalls claims they are, then why is it that nowhere on the McCalls web site, or the Simplicity web site, or the Butterick web site, or the Vogue web site, is there ANY mention of restrictions upon the use of patterns?

    Of course these companies will lie to you about copyrights. It is in their best financial interests because you will buy pattern after pattern from them. I have not been able to locate a single federal lawsuit about the commercial use of patterns. And I have looked, and looked.

    I do not have a copy of the recent McCalls article but when I get one I will deconstruct the McCalls lies on my web site.

    McCalls has NO registered copyrights on its patterns. Neither does Butterick or Simplicity. Vogue has some back in the 1950s probably before the copyright office started refusing to register patterns.

  14. #39
    tooMuchFabric's Avatar
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    I haven't bought a clothing/sewing pattern in a couple of decades,
    but when I did, there were on some of them stated restrictions as to how many items could be made from that particular copy of the pattern before another pattern must be purchased;
    stated restriction that even though the pattern was multi-sized ( as in Size X-Small thru X-Large all printed on one sheet ) it was forbidden to make more than one size item from the pattern;
    and that usage must be limited to home non-commercial items, including not for charity sales.
    I do not know what patterns say nowadays.
    I hope the restrictions have changed.

    Quote Originally Posted by tabberone
    If, as McCalls asserts in this recent article, copyright restrictions are what Mccalls claims they are, then why is it that nowhere on the McCalls web site, or the Simplicity web site, or the Butterick web site, or the Vogue web site, is there ANY mention of restrictions upon the use of patterns?

    Of course these companies will lie to you about copyrights. It is in their best financial interests because you will buy pattern after pattern from them. I have not been able to locate a single federal lawsuit about the commercial use of patterns. And I have looked, and looked.

    I do not have a copy of the recent McCalls article but when I get one I will deconstruct the McCalls lies on my web site.

    McCalls has NO registered copyrights on its patterns. Neither does Butterick or Simplicity. Vogue has some back in the 1950s probably before the copyright office started refusing to register patterns.

  15. #40
    Super Member quilt3311's Avatar
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    As I understand this, credit to the designer should be on the quilt.

  16. #41
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    ===============Oh pooh!! - rules, rules, rules==============

  17. #42
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    What about our BOW TUCKS? Everyone is making them, showing them and some are even selling them. I have looked on my pattern and no where do it say anything about except all rights reserved. On the other hand I have bought Lazy girl patterns lately and just looked, it says as follows
    This pattern is for personal use. Items cannot be made for sale for this pattern. I also have a McCalls pattern for bags and it only says All rights reserved.
    So does this mean that if someone buys a pattern goes to a seamstress and has a dress made according to the pattern is this legal. I'm making a quilt from Fons & Porter right now and following the pattern but I'm giving it away and I will not be asking anyone for permission.
    This is such a very hard thing to understand with all the pattern magazines out, we have all made quilts from them. I do not sell anything, but I was going to enter one in a show, now I have changed my mind.

  18. #43
    Senior Member Sewze's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by harrishwhippets
    What about our BOW TUCKS? Everyone is making them, showing them and some are even selling them. I have looked on my pattern and no where do it say anything about except all rights reserved. On the other hand I have bought Lazy girl patterns lately and just looked, it says as follows
    This pattern is for personal use. Items cannot be made for sale for this pattern. I also have a McCalls pattern for bags and it only says All rights reserved.
    So does this mean that if someone buys a pattern goes to a seamstress and has a dress made according to the pattern is this legal. I'm making a quilt from Fons & Porter right now and following the pattern but I'm giving it away and I will not be asking anyone for permission.
    This is such a very hard thing to understand with all the pattern magazines out, we have all made quilts from them. I do not sell anything, but I was going to enter one in a show, not I have changed my mind.
    Yes, what about our "Bow Tucks"? I just made a second one and gave it to my doctor, as she had admired mine so much, and she just loves it and me. I also just looked on the pattern and nowhere could I find any copyright reference.

  19. #44
    Super Member LindaR's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by stitchinwitch
    ===============Oh pooh!! - rules, rules, rules==============
    my feelings exactly... :thumbup:

  20. #45
    Super Member cbridges22's Avatar
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    Hear,Hear!I agree.Anyway anything I make sure would not be mistaken for the real thing,I am just not that good.
    Quote Originally Posted by katmom54
    Sorry, but I am tired of all the issues about copyrights and who can use what and who can show where. After reading some of these forums I feel like a criminal every time I see a really pretty quilt on the QB and I bookmark it for future reference...I am afraid that one day I will make a quilt and give it to someone as a gift and the 'original' artist will see it and come after me for royalites or something. I feel like I need to enclose a disclaimer with every project i do, and provide a letter of authenticity.
    Has crafting (ie, quilting) really become that cut-throat and commercial?
    I am not a crook - I don't steal from the LQS, I don't photocopy all my purchased patterns and sell them,and I don't sneak pics at quilt shows to make cheap multiples of the 'winner' to sell on Ebay .
    BUT....I am a crafter who enjoys other designs and techniques and incorporate them into my own projects. If I enter a show, I will abide by their rules (but have less and less interest in showing if it is that complicated) ...and since I have no plans to snitch designs and mass market them
    ...I am not going to worry about copyrights anymore.

  21. #46
    Junior Member Jeandrig's Avatar
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    I have a question... How do you find the McCalls quilting magazine on line? Some have said they prefer this magazine. So I was hoping to view it.

  22. #47
    Junior Member ekbuckeye's Avatar
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    Seems to me that, if these laws are so stringent, we couldn't have garage sales or donate items we no longer want or need.

  23. #48
    Super Member TexasGurl's Avatar
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    I understand the aspect of copywright - but I also have a real problem with McCall's (or any other publication) saying that permission must be requested from a "quilt designer" - for QUILTS THAT ARE JUST VARIATIONS OF TRADITIONAL, COMMON, LONG-USED BLOCK PATTERNS
    Aren't these considered to be in the public domain ???

    EVERY magazine out there is today has ENDLESS variations of 9-patches, log cabins, churn dashes, stars, on and on ... (books & patterns too)
    Many of these "designer" quilts only differ from another in the actual FABRICS used
    How can ANOTHER churn dash or 9-patch variation etc be called an ORIGINAL design ???
    What really constitutes a ORIGINAL quilt design today ??? :roll:

  24. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by BRenea
    As quilters, we gather information and inspiration from so many sources I have to wonder if any of us can make something truly original. Even if we design our own quilts, haven't we been influenced by what we've seen previously? I understand the protective nature of copyrights, but it all seems to have gone too far. :?
    I have seen many commercisl patterns for sale on different websites or in stores that very, very closely resemble other published patterns, or are identical to them. Each had a "designer's" name on it. How can this happen but the quilt guilds shows be policed??

  25. #50
    Super Member greaterexp's Avatar
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    Sometimes, I wish we could have kept the mindset of less regulation and just commonsense decency. The world has changed! I am still confused after reading all these posts as to what is really legal. I think it makes sense that if I design a pattern for a whole quilt which is unique (whether or not the block design is entirely my own), and I go to the trouble and expense of making up and printing the pattern with directions and accurate measurements, I should be able to protect my investment in the actual pattern; no one else should be able to copy the pattern instructions and then sell them. But once I make the item from the pattern, I think it should be mine to do with as I wish. It's very unlikely that I could copy exactly the very same product from that pattern. What will we do when every recipe is copyrighted?

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