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Thread: *frustrated*----design process not working like it should

  1. #1
    Super Member Flying_V_Goddess's Avatar
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    I need to vent or otherwise I'll bang my head against the keyboard.

    I haven't been in much of a quilting mood to construct my Flying Ninja Stars quilt with the fabric provided by bj (or construct something with the fabric Sue sent me, for that matter) so I've been putting forth my designing skills on other projects. My main focus is the Wind Waker sea map. And its not going too well.

    First of all, doesn't help that I don't own a copy of the game. I used to, but it mysteriously disappeared (and the 20 minute demo on my Zelda collection disc doesn't help much). So without it I can't create the templates for the islands or find inspiration for designs. Not to mention if I ever want to create the stain glass windows in the Master Sword room I can't recreate the design for those.

    Then, I asked someone on the board if they'd make an accurate layout of the map for me in EQ. I was able to download the version they put in their own colors, but not the colorless one so I could put it in my own colors. My Internet will stop sending information halfway through and then I have to hang up and reconnect and start over.

    The main thing that's driving me nuts is this design I want to put in the outer border. Well, I don't have a design yet. I want a Celtic knot border to go in the corners, but not having much luck finding one. I've probably been through a thousand websites trying to look for one that I think would work well. I tried making my own...got a book and downloaded a free trial of a computer program to try and make one. I can re-create every single knot that can fit in a square or retangular space in this program (I did all the ones in the book and many more from the net). But when I try to branch out and do my own thing...just doesn't work or create medicore results.

    Plus, I have this crazy idea of screen printing my islands and my Celtic knot design (if I ever get one I like) onto the fabric...which, of course, I've never screen printed before (seen a demostration done and looked at another 1000 websites researching the process). And I realized just how expensive screen printing will be if I do end up doing it...probably more than the rest of the quilt.

    So this map has turned into this insane project that I'm not sure will ever get done. Arrrrrgh!


    ...I'm gonna go eat some chocolate and listen to Bjork.

  2. #2
    helenrhoades's Avatar
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    I wonder if it is possible to do iron on transfers rather than screen printing? It would be a lot cheaper and easier. I hope you can pull this off, I would LOVE to see a Zelda quilt!

  3. #3
    Super Member vicki reno's Avatar
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    Maybe you could try printing on fabric? I saw a quilt that had a figure printed on fabric in the door of a house and it looked great. Would that be an option perhaps? I can't fault your methods of dealing with frustration--You hit that right on the money--isn't chocolate a great cure all! Wish it would have an effect on high blood pressure. Boy would I be healthy then!!
    Good luck on your design process. You have a very creative mind. I am good at following patterns, but very seldom branch out on my own. Can't wait to see it, cause I know you are clever enough to work this through and come up with something.

  4. #4
    bj
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    Just keep on keepin' on, V. You'll work through it. Just make sure you keep plenty of chocolate on hand. Do you have Kinko's there? They might could help you out with printing you colorless map pattern. You might ask them if they could print your islands onto the fabric that's made to go through a printer. The kids at our Kinko's here are pretty clever and will try just about anything you ask them to.

  5. #5
    Super Member Flying_V_Goddess's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by helenrhoades
    I wonder if it is possible to do iron on transfers rather than screen printing? It would be a lot cheaper and easier. I hope you can pull this off, I would LOVE to see a Zelda quilt!
    Two problems with that.

    One: The printer isn't working so I couldn't print the islands onto the transfers

    Two: Islands might be too small to cut out. ...still haven't figured out my sizing just yet. H***, I just might decide to make it exceedingly huge so it covers the entire wall and looks like that world map on the Pirates of the Carribean movie the map maker was inking...talk about putting new meaning to the term "wall hanging".


    Quote Originally Posted by vicki reno
    Maybe you could try printing on fabric? I saw a quilt that had a figure printed on fabric in the door of a house and it looked great. Would that be an option perhaps? I can't fault your methods of dealing with frustration--You hit that right on the money--isn't chocolate a great cure all! Wish it would have an effect on high blood pressure. Boy would I be healthy then!!
    Good luck on your design process. You have a very creative mind. I am good at following patterns, but very seldom branch out on my own. Can't wait to see it, cause I know you are clever enough to work this through and come up with something.
    Ah, chocolate: life's little therepist. ...suddenly I got this weird thought of a White Mage from Final Fantasy constructed out of chocolate. Well, chocolate is a cure all and white mages have healing spells......anyways.

    You mean like printing with a printer? Well, I don't have a printer that actually works. And if I understand correctly, I would need special fabric for it and I couldn't just print it onto whatever fabric I got. Like I couldn't take the fabric in the background color I want and print out the islands onto it. I'm thinking it would make it any cheaper if I have to use specially treated fabric for 49 blocks and a border to print out designs onto them. At least with the screen printing I can print on any fabric I want.


    Quote Originally Posted by bj
    Just keep on keepin' on, V. You'll work through it. Just make sure you keep plenty of chocolate on hand. Do you have Kinko's there? They might could help you out with printing you colorless map pattern. You might ask them if they could print your islands onto the fabric that's made to go through a printer. The kids at our Kinko's here are pretty clever and will try just about anything you ask them to.
    Nope, no Kinko's around here. Maybe in La Crosse or Eau Claire, but both are an hour away from here.

    Actually, I don't need to print out the map layout. I just needed it to see if my measurements for the map and borders would work out and I think everything looks fine. But she had put them in different colors so I asked her if she could post a colorless version so I could bring it up on Paint and put it in the colors I had in mind and see how that would look. But she posted both of them where you have to download the picture. The first one downloaded okay, but I can't get the colorless one to download. My Internet keeps on wanted to quit about halfway through and it takes me about 20 minutes to download a file like that.

  6. #6
    Super Member Moonpi's Avatar
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    There's a gif version here
    http://www.unlimitedgamer.net/covera...eaChartMap.gif

    Right-click and save picture as.... whatever, then you should be able to open in Paint.

  7. #7
    Super Member Pam Pollock's Avatar
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    I wonder if you could try using the batik method instead of silk screen printing?

  8. #8
    Super Member Flying_V_Goddess's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pam Pollock
    I wonder if you could try using the batik method instead of silk screen printing?
    Resist dying? Well, I'm not sure. It could work, but it would require me to carve out 49 stamps plus one for the border. I know the one for the border might be a problem since it would be huge no matter what the size of the quilt is (I'm leaning towards 60.5"...I spent like three hours last night figuring out the sizes...so the border would get pretty big.) Plus, melted parafin and beeswax...I'm thinking that would get pretty messy. I remember trying to make candles once and that was a disaster. I can imagine dipping stamps into wax and then stamping onto fabric (not to mention dying the fabric) would turn into one giantic mess. Not that screen printing couldn't get messy, but ink seems a lot easier to clean up than wax.

    On the other hand, the supplies for resist dying could be cheaper than screen printing. I'm not sure. I'd have to look into it first. I think something to melt the wax in and something to carve the stamps out of would be the things that cost the most. Wouldn't need to buy parafin wax. But I wouldn't know where to buy any of this. Possibly Hobby Lobby, but the cloest one is an hour away...

  9. #9
    bj
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    What about just plain painting on fabric using fabric paints. You could thin down like watercolors and they'd go pretty far. Then you could just use a big flat white sheet. Pencil your grid onto the sheet, cut the sheet to the size you want, and then just get after it. A lot of your detail could come from your quilting in the water areas and trapunto could add height to your islands. You're way more creative than I am, but it might work.

  10. #10
    Super Member Pam Pollock's Avatar
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    How many colors are you using in your design? If it's only 2 or 3 then it wouldn't be too much of a pain. You could practice on a large square of material to see if Batiking it would work for you. I wasn't thinking about carving blocks for block printing...I was thinking you could start by drawing your design (w/pencil) on a large square of the lightest color material you plan to use in your design. Stretch your material out by stapling edges to a wooden frame (at least 2 opposite sides). With assorted size artist paint brushes or Batiking tools you can paint the hot wax on the part of the design that you would want to remain the light color (be sure the wax penetrates thru the material for the best wax resist) & then dip the whole square into a cool dye bath of your next color. Always dye your lightest colors & graduate with each step to the next color in sequence from lightest to darkest. After the next color dries, then you could wax the part of the design that you want to stay the 2nd color & then dip into your final darkest color for the last dyebath. You can crinkle it a little while in dyebaths if you want a crackled look.
    Make a double boiler (if you don't have one). I used to put beeswax in large metal cans or use an old cast iron coffee pots & stick the cans or coffee pot in a large cast iron frying pan & then pour water in the pan around the cans or iron pot (thrift stores usually have these items cheap. My mom never wanted me to use her good pans. :( Be sure to check your water level so that it doesn't run dry & cause the wax to get too hot. Beeswax is more expensive & works a little better but I have had good results with parafin wax also. You would want to use an old iron (from a thrift store?) also. I use news print on top of the batik to iron out the wax. Watch carefully so that the print from the news paper doesn't transfer. I always used black & white print & usually always around & available. This is just one idea but not sure what your design is. Someone else may have another idea for you that would work better. Good luck with your project. It is a challange & you will figure it out. :D

  11. #11
    Super Member Moonpi's Avatar
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    Is this for a wall or a bed? I've had luck with the permanent fabric markers. Depending on your fabric, paints and dyes spread in unexpected ways. I'm wondering if using a sea-colored fabric, and bleach applied with a nib pen (use Chlor Stop to neutralize) would give you a good clean outline to overdye, paint, or mark. I've used a brand of fabric dye/paint called Luminiere for gold accents that gives beautiful gilded effects. Dharma Trading has kits for under $12 with lots of colors. Dye-na-flow is good, too, for regular colors, and blends well. Kits with a batch of small bottles run the same price.

    http://www.dharmatrading.com/html/en...ints_kits.html
    While you're there, sign up for their free catalog and look through the tutorials. They have dyes and batik supplies, prepared for dye cloth, all sorts of fun things.

  12. #12
    Super Member Flying_V_Goddess's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Moonpi
    Is this for a wall or a bed? I've had luck with the permanent fabric markers. Depending on your fabric, paints and dyes spread in unexpected ways. I'm wondering if using a sea-colored fabric, and bleach applied with a nib pen (use Chlor Stop to neutralize) would give you a good clean outline to overdye, paint, or mark. I've used a brand of fabric dye/paint called Luminiere for gold accents that gives beautiful gilded effects. Dharma Trading has kits for under $12 with lots of colors. Dye-na-flow is good, too, for regular colors, and blends well. Kits with a batch of small bottles run the same price.

    http://www.dharmatrading.com/html/en...ints_kits.html
    While you're there, sign up for their free catalog and look through the tutorials. They have dyes and batik supplies, prepared for dye cloth, all sorts of fun things.
    Supposed to be for a wall. And with the way things are going...a pretty big wall. lol.

    Well, besides the sea colored fabric part (I plan on using a more "antique" look to this map---different colors of browns), it sounds do-able. The only thing I could think of that would be a problem would be the islands with very sharp or rounded edges (like Six Eye Reef or Pawprint Isle) or that have very small details. I'll keep it in mind. In the meantime, I'll look more into this Dharma Trading Company.

    Sue sent me a copy of the blank sea map cnolan made up for me so I should have a colored in version pretty soon.

  13. #13
    Super Member Flying_V_Goddess's Avatar
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    This is kind of what I want it to look like. I haven't decided on a border design so just threw one in there, but it'll be in that color and about that size. No islands yet 'cause---well, I'm not going to draw them in Paint, but I'm still working on the sizing of my islands. This would be so much easier to figure out if I still had the game.

  14. #14
    Super Member Barb M's Avatar
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    I guess i'm not very computer literate, and don't know about these programmes, i find it easy to just make my patterns up on graph paper. Maybe i'm in the stone age lol

  15. #15
    Super Member Flying_V_Goddess's Avatar
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    I figured out some price related things for various techniques to get this done (screen printing, stamping, batik)...haven't gotten all of it done because Dharma Trading didn't have everything I need. Batik is the cheapest so far. Screen printing the most expensive ($60+!!!)

  16. #16
    Super Member Pam Pollock's Avatar
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    Nice design!!! Are you planning on having the thin white outline in your design? I think you could do this using Batik method. You could start out with white material & pencil your designs onto individual squares (or rectangles) of material to be sewn together later. That way if one turns out good & maybe one doesn't, you wouldn't have to redo as many. You would start with waxing your thin white line & then dip in the salmon dye & air dry or cool setting on hair dryer & then wax the salmon color background & then dip in a brown dye for the final color. Then dry & iron out the wax. Voila!

  17. #17
    Super Member Flying_V_Goddess's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pam Pollock
    Nice design!!! Are you planning on having the thin white outline in your design? I think you could do this using Batik method. You could start out with white material & pencil your designs onto individual squares (or rectangles) of material to be sewn together later. That way if one turns out good & maybe one doesn't, you wouldn't have to redo as many. You would start with waxing your thin white line & then dip in the salmon dye & air dry or cool setting on hair dryer & then wax the salmon color background & then dip in a brown dye for the final color. Then dry & iron out the wax. Voila!
    What do you mean by a thin white outline?

    My original idea for doing this was to take the outlines of the blocks with the seam allowances and the island design and screen print it onto the background fabric color. Then I could just cut out the outlines of the blocks and their islands would already be on so I could get right to sewing. I had thought about doing it all on one big piece of fabric (no cutting...almost like a panel), but its too big to do. But it'll cost me $60 if I screen print it...and that's if I use one screen that's big enough for two or three blocks, screen print, clean off the photo emulsion, put on new photo emulsion, put on two or three more blocks, screen print, repeat.

    So I gotta come up with something else. Batik I'm kind of skeptical about...I just think with me it'll turn into one HUGE mess (me + hot wax = disater). Fabric stamping might work, but the Dharma Trading company didn't have permanent fabric ink in the color I need for stamping (which I'm wondering if you could just use screen printing ink for stamping) and they didn't have linolium blocks big enough for the stamps...plus I have to make 49 of them, which will get expensive unless I can come up with a cheap alternative.

    Eh, I'll figure something out.

  18. #18
    Super Member Pam Pollock's Avatar
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    Ok...I had to do a double take. I guess what I thought was a thin white line was around the brown design. Maybe it's just the salmon color but my computer screen or my eyes just registered it as white.

    Batiking is not that scary unless your not good around stoves? I did batiking back when I was in high school & I was self taught. I had some that were better than others & the good ones just come with practice. I still have some linoleum blocks that I finished carving but never printed -LOL. 49 blocks?? That would be a lot of carving & very time consuming to do as many as you need to do. I honestly think it would be worth a try to try batik but I will be interested in seeing your finished project no matter what method you decide to use. Neat design! :D :D

  19. #19
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    V - you can make your own photo transfer fabric....you'll need the specific chemical and just treat your fabric. It is extremely cost effective if you plan to use a lot of fabric. If you don't want to take that route, try just cutting out the shapes and appliqueing to the background fabric. I can see what you are trying to accomplish so hate to see you so frustrated that you set it aside and never go back to it. Dharma Trading might have the chemicals you need to make your own photo transfer fabric - I don't recall as have not been on that site in a while.

    Another option instead of applique is to layer under another color and cut out the pieces. For example, have your background fabric the sea color and underneath place a piece of brown for the island(s). Just cut out the sea color to show the brown for the islands. This could tend to waste fabric but then you have the potential to build your scrap pile!

    And if nothing else...have more chocolate and maybe switch to Godsmack and play it loud! :D

  20. #20
    Super Member Flying_V_Goddess's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pam Pollock
    Ok...I had to do a double take. I guess what I thought was a thin white line was around the brown design. Maybe it's just the salmon color but my computer screen or my eyes just registered it as white.

    Batiking is not that scary unless your not good around stoves? I did batiking back when I was in high school & I was self taught. I had some that were better than others & the good ones just come with practice. I still have some linoleum blocks that I finished carving but never printed -LOL. 49 blocks?? That would be a lot of carving & very time consuming to do as many as you need to do. I honestly think it would be worth a try to try batik but I will be interested in seeing your finished project no matter what method you decide to use. Neat design! :D :D
    Well, there are 49 islands, but some islands are the same (like the fairy islands and the triangle isles), just in different locations in the block area. I'd have to check, but it may be possible that I can turn the block for one island 90 degrees and get the layout for another island. But there would still be at least 30 different island designs. I wish the screen printing supplies were cheaper. I think I'd like the results and I could possibly use screen printing in another project.

    I think with the amount of work I need to do, the batik would probably be overly time consuming to do all those islands.


    Quote Originally Posted by Paulette
    V - you can make your own photo transfer fabric....you'll need the specific chemical and just treat your fabric. It is extremely cost effective if you plan to use a lot of fabric. If you don't want to take that route, try just cutting out the shapes and appliqueing to the background fabric. I can see what you are trying to accomplish so hate to see you so frustrated that you set it aside and never go back to it. Dharma Trading might have the chemicals you need to make your own photo transfer fabric - I don't recall as have not been on that site in a while.

    Another option instead of applique is to layer under another color and cut out the pieces. For example, have your background fabric the sea color and underneath place a piece of brown for the island(s). Just cut out the sea color to show the brown for the islands. This could tend to waste fabric but then you have the potential to build your scrap pile!

    And if nothing else...have more chocolate and maybe switch to Godsmack and play it loud! :D
    How exactly is this photo transfer thing done?

    I get what you're talking about with the alternative option to applique. I've seen it done in a magazine (with cute batik turtles) and on the HGTV website for stained glass quilting.

    If all else fails, I'll hit the chocolate frosting (right out of the jar!) and watch some Gundam Wing.

  21. #21
    Super Member Moonpi's Avatar
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    Here's the map as a jpg

    map without legend
    Name:  Attachment-3213.jpe
Views: 27
Size:  66.5 KB

  22. #22

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    Have you tried to go buy the game again??There are game stops that sell used games,etc and also ebay. Then you can have the visuals you want without costing you an arm and leg:))I am looking forward to this quilt!:))Skeat

  23. #23
    Super Member Flying_V_Goddess's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Skeat
    Have you tried to go buy the game again??There are game stops that sell used games,etc and also ebay. Then you can have the visuals you want without costing you an arm and leg:))I am looking forward to this quilt!:))Skeat
    I haven't been to Game Stop lately so I haven't gotten around to buying it. Although, if I went there now I might forget about Zelda and get tempted to buy Condemned 2. I kind of did the same with another game I wanted to get when Nick took me birthday shopping........could have gotten Beautiful Katamari, which I've wanted for like forever, but instead chose the totally awesome Lost Odyssey.

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