Not to keep stirring the pot, but....
09-02-2010, 05:02 AM
#191
Junior Member
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: New Hampshire
Posts: 115
Originally Posted by Conniequilts
I don't generally weigh in on topics like this but it has been consistent and confusing.
This is my view point (right or wrong) - I have paid for the pattern so what I make with it is my business and what I do with it after that is my business.
I understand I should not re-sell the pattern and especially not for a profit. I also have no problem with respecting not copying it and sharing it with others.
I strongly believe their control over a quilt should END with the purchasing of the pattern.
Just my thoughts ;)
This is my view point (right or wrong) - I have paid for the pattern so what I make with it is my business and what I do with it after that is my business.
I understand I should not re-sell the pattern and especially not for a profit. I also have no problem with respecting not copying it and sharing it with others.
I strongly believe their control over a quilt should END with the purchasing of the pattern.
Just my thoughts ;)
Give credit were credit is due. Add the designers name to your label even if it is as "inspired by".
09-02-2010, 05:40 AM
#192
Super Member
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Horseheads, NY 14845
Posts: 4,025
Originally Posted by Conniequilts
This will tick lots of people off I am sure (and I apologize ahead of time).
Can any of you, who have copyrighted your patterns, prove you have NOT ever repeated a naturally created pattern from someone back in the 1800's? Before copyright laws existed?
If you can't, then how can you copyright it, how can you call it original?. It is not someone else's work and you are "stealing" credit from them?
Are you calling it original because you took "their" original blocks and placed them in a differnt order?
I don't know, I'm sure someone is now angry with me and wants to argue and I apologize, but am thinking nothing is original cuz it all started WAY BACK WHEN.
Just my right or wrong thoughts again, don't hate me :(
Can any of you, who have copyrighted your patterns, prove you have NOT ever repeated a naturally created pattern from someone back in the 1800's? Before copyright laws existed?
If you can't, then how can you copyright it, how can you call it original?. It is not someone else's work and you are "stealing" credit from them?
Are you calling it original because you took "their" original blocks and placed them in a differnt order?
I don't know, I'm sure someone is now angry with me and wants to argue and I apologize, but am thinking nothing is original cuz it all started WAY BACK WHEN.
Just my right or wrong thoughts again, don't hate me :(
09-02-2010, 05:55 AM
#193
Super Member
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Wisconsin
Posts: 1,152
Originally Posted by quilterguy27
Another Mag with the same statement about who can make what for who and who has control over what you make. I've heard so many of you say you are cancelling your subscription of McCalls because of the copyright statement in the front of the magazine. Well, I just got my issue of Quilter's Home mag and it has the same statement in it. I'm only due one more issue and I won't be renewing my subscription to this mag or any other. I will be checking from now on. Thanks for the other thread about this topic! I just went and Googled Creative Crafts Group, LLC and Quilter's Home is under the same umbrella as McCalls as well as a bunch of other magazines, so if anyone else is thinking of discontinuing your subscription or for any other reason you might want to check them out, you can find out who has this statement in their magazine. Just my little rant. Thanks for listening!
09-02-2010, 06:02 AM
#194
Junior Member
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Toms River, NJ
Posts: 135
You guys really ought to get the scoop from a copyright attorney. It doesn't matter how you feel on the topic. You have to obey the laws. BTW, anything printed prior to 1923 is copyright free. This I know. Also changing a pattern does not make it copyright free. There are plenty of copyright free books we can use to develop our own patterns. Dover makes a lot of these. Clip art can also be copyright free. HIH
09-02-2010, 06:09 AM
#195
Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 327
Originally Posted by 2ursula
This is not so when you only buy the license to use a product (software is another example of the same thing). When you buy MS's Office software then you don't own the software. You have bought only the license to use it.
And yes, does MS ever restrict usage....
Just don't buy any patterns sold with such restrictions. There are a gazillion ways to put commonly used quilting elements together your way (the only right way).
The emphasis is on "commonly used" and "commonly available".
You can't have (and won't get) copyrights on commonly available patterns. Period. For a design to be protected it must be NEW AND UNIQUE.
The 'day and night pattern' on the quilters cache site for example is neither new nor unique. Don't worry about using it the way you see fit.
Why would anybody pay good money for patterns (or the license to use a pattern for personal use only) that your own head can produce for you by the dozens in an hour?
And yes, does MS ever restrict usage....
Just don't buy any patterns sold with such restrictions. There are a gazillion ways to put commonly used quilting elements together your way (the only right way).
The emphasis is on "commonly used" and "commonly available".
You can't have (and won't get) copyrights on commonly available patterns. Period. For a design to be protected it must be NEW AND UNIQUE.
The 'day and night pattern' on the quilters cache site for example is neither new nor unique. Don't worry about using it the way you see fit.
Why would anybody pay good money for patterns (or the license to use a pattern for personal use only) that your own head can produce for you by the dozens in an hour?
Open Office is one. It can do most that MS stuff can do and it's free. I believe Adobe PDF is another.
09-02-2010, 06:13 AM
#196
Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 327
Originally Posted by PatriceJ
ok. do you realize you just violated the website copyright by copying and pasting their words into your comment? :lol:
that's why we use hyperlinks directly to the source. ;-)
that's why we use hyperlinks directly to the source. ;-)
09-02-2010, 06:25 AM
#197
Administrator
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Southeast Georgia, USA
Posts: 9,093
this conversation is typical of nearly every other conversation we've had about copyrights.
useful, easily understood and accurate information has been provided by several members. unfortunately it's lost in the pages of opinion and protest. :lol:
let's catch up.
1. nobody can slap a copyright on blocks already in the public domain.
2. under most circumstances, they can't slap a copyright on quilt layouts designed using only blocks from the public domain.
3. the instructions and illustrations are copyright protected. the owner of the copyrights can tell us to not copy and distribute them without their permission.
4. copyright protection does not extend to the items made from the patterns. some designers believe they do, but they are mistaken.
the legal issues and principles are:
-the designer/author/creator/owner right to retain her identity as the creator of that pattern (the instructions and illustrations).
-the designer/author/creator/owner right to realize income or benefit.
-the customer's obligation to make reasonable use of the protected pattern. making and selling a bazillion quilts from another designer's pattern would most likely not be considered reasonable use. putting one into a show and claiming to have designed it yourself would most likely not be considered reasonable use. giving one or a few of the quilts to friends and family would most likely be considered reasonable use. even selling a few would most likely be considered reasonable use - especially if you gave the designer/author/creator the credit she deserves.
politicians, lawyers, and consumers make the laws seem a lot more complicated than they really are or need to be.
put yourself in the designer's shoes. the right thing should then be obvious.
and please take note of an important fact: when a designer is published in a magazine, she has quite often been required to transfer ownership of the copyrights to the publisher. she loses control, so we should probably not blame her if we don't like what the publisher does.
useful, easily understood and accurate information has been provided by several members. unfortunately it's lost in the pages of opinion and protest. :lol:
let's catch up.
1. nobody can slap a copyright on blocks already in the public domain.
2. under most circumstances, they can't slap a copyright on quilt layouts designed using only blocks from the public domain.
3. the instructions and illustrations are copyright protected. the owner of the copyrights can tell us to not copy and distribute them without their permission.
4. copyright protection does not extend to the items made from the patterns. some designers believe they do, but they are mistaken.
the legal issues and principles are:
-the designer/author/creator/owner right to retain her identity as the creator of that pattern (the instructions and illustrations).
-the designer/author/creator/owner right to realize income or benefit.
-the customer's obligation to make reasonable use of the protected pattern. making and selling a bazillion quilts from another designer's pattern would most likely not be considered reasonable use. putting one into a show and claiming to have designed it yourself would most likely not be considered reasonable use. giving one or a few of the quilts to friends and family would most likely be considered reasonable use. even selling a few would most likely be considered reasonable use - especially if you gave the designer/author/creator the credit she deserves.
politicians, lawyers, and consumers make the laws seem a lot more complicated than they really are or need to be.
put yourself in the designer's shoes. the right thing should then be obvious.
and please take note of an important fact: when a designer is published in a magazine, she has quite often been required to transfer ownership of the copyrights to the publisher. she loses control, so we should probably not blame her if we don't like what the publisher does.
09-02-2010, 06:36 AM
#198
Super Member
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Wisconsin
Posts: 1,152
Originally Posted by quilterguy27
Another Mag with the same statement about who can make what for who and who has control over what you make. I've heard so many of you say you are cancelling your subscription of McCalls because of the copyright statement in the front of the magazine. Well, I just got my issue of Quilter's Home mag and it has the same statement in it. I'm only due one more issue and I won't be renewing my subscription to this mag or any other. I will be checking from now on. Thanks for the other thread about this topic! I just went and Googled Creative Crafts Group, LLC and Quilter's Home is under the same umbrella as McCalls as well as a bunch of other magazines, so if anyone else is thinking of discontinuing your subscription or for any other reason you might want to check them out, you can find out who has this statement in their magazine. Just my little rant. Thanks for listening!
09-02-2010, 07:01 AM
#199
Super Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: North Canton, Ohio
Posts: 1,403
Thanks so much PatriceJ!!!!
I now have a much more clear view of how it all works. It's by no means your fault, but why the heck hasn't someone made it this concise before now. I thought I understood it all before, but now I really got it. Makes total sense to me. Thanks so much for putting it into plain english for us to grasp the gist of it. Now we should all "HAVE IT". Put it to bed now?
Can I quote you on this Patrice?
I now have a much more clear view of how it all works. It's by no means your fault, but why the heck hasn't someone made it this concise before now. I thought I understood it all before, but now I really got it. Makes total sense to me. Thanks so much for putting it into plain english for us to grasp the gist of it. Now we should all "HAVE IT". Put it to bed now?
Can I quote you on this Patrice?
09-02-2010, 09:31 AM
#200
Administrator
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Southeast Georgia, USA
Posts: 9,093
Originally Posted by quilterguy27
Thanks so much PatriceJ!!!!
I now have a much more clear view of how it all works. It's by no means your fault, but why the heck hasn't someone made it this concise before now. I thought I understood it all before, but now I really got it. Makes total sense to me. Thanks so much for putting it into plain english for us to grasp the gist of it. Now we should all "HAVE IT". Put it to bed now?
Can I quote you on this Patrice?
I now have a much more clear view of how it all works. It's by no means your fault, but why the heck hasn't someone made it this concise before now. I thought I understood it all before, but now I really got it. Makes total sense to me. Thanks so much for putting it into plain english for us to grasp the gist of it. Now we should all "HAVE IT". Put it to bed now?
Can I quote you on this Patrice?
many members have boiled it down many times. the explanations get buried within minutes. :lol:
i would rather you didn't quote me. i am not a lawyer. i am not a representative of the government office of any country.
i've just spent 5 minutes googling the topic and have found an article that indicates i might be wrong in believing we can't sell things made from copyright (cr) protected patterns without permission from the owner of the cr.
this is the only area i consider at all fuzzy. but here's why i have never worried about that and would never worry about that: i don't want use other people's patterns for anything i might think about selling someday. i design my own and charge "extra" for the fact that it's one of a kind.
http://www.tabberone.com/
http://www.straw.com/equilters/libra...copyright.html
http://www.quiltingbusiness.com/quilting-copyright.htm
http://www.quilt.com/FAQS/CopyrightFAQ.html
http://www.getcreativeshow.com/Craft...copyrights.htm
http://www.paulrapp.com/display_article.php?id=6
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
Sunflowerzz
For Vintage & Antique Machine Enthusiasts
23
10-21-2013 06:09 PM
