Welcome to the Quilting Board!

Already a member? Login above
loginabove
OR
To post questions, help other quilters and reduce advertising (like the one on your left), join our quilting community. It's free!

Page 5 of 10 FirstFirst ... 4 5 6 ... LastLast
Results 101 to 125 of 237

Thread: Not to keep stirring the pot, but....

  1. #101
    Senior Member JANW's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    northern, CA
    Posts
    734
    Quote Originally Posted by Conniequilts
    I don't generally weigh in on topics like this but it has been consistent and confusing.

    This is my view point (right or wrong) - I have paid for the pattern so what I make with it is my business and what I do with it after that is my business.

    I understand I should not re-sell the pattern and especially not for a profit. I also have no problem with respecting not copying it and sharing it with others.

    I strongly believe their control over a quilt should END with the purchasing of the pattern.

    Just my thoughts ;)

    ME TOO

  2. #102
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Posts
    343
    Quote Originally Posted by maggiek
    Sorry. I have to disagree. Making patterns is this person's livelihood and the copyright is all that protects their income and rights to their own work. It would be like copying a book and sharing it with anyone. The author loses their right to sell the only thing they have - their intellectual property. Asking permission to use a pattern is not a big deal - it is just the right thing to do.
    Except the only thing copyrighted is the pattern, not the quilt made from it, as shown in other examples on this topic.

  3. #103
    Super Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Posts
    3,578
    http://www.womenfolk.com/quilting_hi...olitionist.htm

    Ohhhhh shame shame shame - here are a couple patterns that I have seen COPIED by some of our famous quilt designers! BTW, by changing the colors, it is NOT an original......... but, when it comes down to it, do we REALLY care??? hmmmm

  4. #104
    Super Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Location
    Newberg, OR
    Posts
    1,941
    I worked in a law office for years. These are boilerplate statements created by lawyers to cover as many contingencies as possible. It is beyond my comprehension that McCalls or anybody else is sending spies out to quilt shows looking for someone who might have displayed one of their quilts without permission. It simply isn't feasible, and it would be terribly expensive. It's like pirating music from the internet. A song/quilt here and there does not a copyright violation make. But if someone is making money--say, a famous quilter--by displaying quilts from patterns in McCalls, then McCalls would probably want to go after that person for a piece of the action.

    Ordinarily, I don't pay any attention to copyright statements unless I'm going to send a quilt off for auction at the Alzheimer's Art Quilt Initiative. AAQI demands it and wants a copy of the permission letter or email that I receive. Most people/companies are gracious in granting permission to use their designs, and in general, it's easy to find them so that I am able to ask. Sometimes I don't get an answer from the person, which I take to mean "no." But most of the time people are delighted that I like their design enough to ask, and gladly give their permission. My avatar is one of those cases. I found the design on a greeting card. The artist is in Germany and I waited several weeks before I heard from her, but she was as nice as could be when I did.

  5. #105
    Super Member Rosyhf's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    Longwood, Florida
    Posts
    2,901
    Some time ago I bought some cd's with old newspaper patterns and one cd had lots of old books of quilt patterns and a another cd had all the embroidery.
    there are hundreds of designs on these cd's.

    All the patterns are copyright free as these patterns start from 1800. I can take any of these blocks and draw them in EQ and make them whatever I wish. Most of of the blocks are blocks we know about anyway.

    I told you guys to get EQ, hahhahahah...but no fooling, EQ is a fun program and it's not hard to do the blocks. How do you think the designers do it.

    I will purchase books from my favorites...like Barbara Brackman or Judy Martin...Judy loves for you to sell you quilts...

  6. #106
    Banned
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Posts
    159
    Quote Originally Posted by Sadiemae
    I keep thinking about something:
    When a designer writes on his/her pattern (Only for personal use, may not sell items made from this pattern.) I can't help but think about what happens in the future.
    For example, suppose I really like a pattern and I make 5 or 6 quilts. I just put them in my stash and they stay there until I die. Okay now say I have a mean Uncle Harry (I don't) and he doesn't want anything I made. So he sells the quilts to get the money because he is mean and greedy, or he auctions them off with the rest of my stuff. Now according to their copywright, Mean Uncle Harry is breaking the law and doesn't even know about it. How would they like to handle this, or does he catch a break because he is dumb.
    Probably the copyright would have expired by then. They don't last forever. (why we have generic drugs)

  7. #107
    Super Member Rosyhf's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    Longwood, Florida
    Posts
    2,901
    Copyrights are expensive and have to be renewed. I doubt if the patterns are CR.

  8. #108
    Junior Member Ellie'sNana's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Location
    NC
    Posts
    283
    Blog Entries
    5
    Quote Originally Posted by Conniequilts
    I don't generally weigh in on topics like this but it has been consistent and confusing.

    This is my view point (right or wrong) - I have paid for the pattern so what I make with it is my business and what I do with it after that is my business.

    I understand I should not re-sell the pattern and especially not for a profit. I also have no problem with respecting not copying it and sharing it with others.

    I strongly believe their control over a quilt should END with the purchasing of the pattern.

    Just my thoughts ;)
    I agree with you. Thanks for putting your thoughts down so clearly.

  9. #109
    Super Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Location
    Fort White, Fl
    Posts
    2,694
    Blog Entries
    1
    Quote Originally Posted by Conniequilts
    I don't generally weigh in on topics like this but it has been consistent and confusing.

    This is my view point (right or wrong) - I have paid for the pattern so what I make with it is my business and what I do with it after that is my business.

    I understand I should not re-sell the pattern and especially not for a profit. I also have no problem with respecting not copying it and sharing it with others.

    I strongly believe their control over a quilt should END with the purchasing of the pattern.

    Just my thoughts ;)

    I totally agree with this one. What I do after I have purchashed the pattern is my business. I would not copy and sell the pattern although some fabric shops do, but as far as the quilt goes unless you use the exact fabric, colors and stitching it is not a copy.

  10. #110
    Junior Member crazicorn's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Location
    Tacoma, WA
    Posts
    124
    Quote Originally Posted by lillybeck
    Quote Originally Posted by Conniequilts
    I don't generally weigh in on topics like this but it has been consistent and confusing.

    This is my view point (right or wrong) - I have paid for the pattern so what I make with it is my business and what I do with it after that is my business.

    I understand I should not re-sell the pattern and especially not for a profit. I also have no problem with respecting not copying it and sharing it with others.

    I strongly believe their control over a quilt should END with the purchasing of the pattern.

    Just my thoughts ;)

    I totally agree with this one. What I do after I have purchashed the pattern is my business. I would not copy and sell the pattern although some fabric shops do, but as far as the quilt goes unless you use the exact fabric, colors and stitching it is not a copy.
    My thoughts exactly (and I believe I read that in a magazine too, just recently)!

  11. #111
    Member
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Posts
    83
    I also doubt that most of the 'protected designs' could actually be CR. If they are in fact CR then somebody should challenge it.
    100,000s of landscape painters paint trees using certain techniques. Have you ever heard of a copyrighted landscape picture?
    Of course, everybody puts his/her own stamp, feel and artistic expression into the painted images.
    Same with quilting.
    Whoever sews simple geometric forms into quilts without duplicating a commercial design stitch by stitch, color by color should be perfectly safe.

    If I wanted to sell a pattern that uses e.g. tesselated stars in a gradated color scheme I would be perfectly safe to do so even if this design is shown e. g. in the quilters cache where many old-fashioned designs are published with the remark "This is an original design ..... "

    My foot! Most of their designs are all but original designs (It's OK, their site is marvelous.) It has been done for many decades by many thousand quilters. These socalled CR warnings are unenforcible, not at the least because the designs have no unique or new elements.

    Same as Michelangelo painting angels. Everybody copied his angels to everybody's delight.

  12. #112
    Junior Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Location
    NC
    Posts
    272
    Once published , isn't a pattern in the public domain and therefore no infringement on a copyright. Any attorneys in the house to guide us?

  13. #113
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Manchester, NH
    Posts
    701
    Quote Originally Posted by C.Cal Quilt Girl
    That's sad considering many of these have been made for years, the economy's in the tank and only the exclusive believe they have the right to limit other view points and variations, considering some use could be the difference between feeding and cloting your family. Not that others aren't trying to do the same, Micro buisness vs Big buisness, and who profits??
    I don't like limiting any one to make a living, at any level, some things are not legally, but morally questionable.
    Whew off the box I come.
    I just wonder how many of these quilt patterns in the mags are really original from start to finish anyway. Maybe they are copying and using patterns from way back without permission themselves!
    Quilting has been going on forever - new patterns cannot be that infinite! What an attitude they have anyway. Why bother to publish the pictures of the quilts with directions on how to make them if they are not to be given or sold? Just how many quilts do we each personally need in our homes, that's what I want to know.
    I'm just disgusted that I had already reordered a couple of mags before this issue was brought up a while ago. Will not order again, believe me.

  14. #114
    Community Manager PatriceJ's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Posts
    7,674
    Blog Entries
    3
    Quote Originally Posted by cafegold2
    Once published , isn't a pattern in the public domain and therefore no infringement on a copyright. Any attorneys in the house to guide us?
    publication in any form is what creates the copyright ... regardless of whether or not it's registered with the feds.

    designers cannot copyright blocks already in the public domain.

    debate rages over whether they can copyright layouts they design using only blocks from the public domain.

    there is no doubt, however, that they can copyright the patterns and instructions they write and illustrate showing us how to make those quilts.

  15. #115
    Zoe
    Zoe is offline
    Junior Member Zoe's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Posts
    109
    We continue on with this debate, don't we? I personally think it's the dumbest move in years, because quilters no longer are free to share anything.

    When our quilt group made a quilt that was published in one of the Fons & Porter magazines for display at our local county fair, I wrote to the magazine to get permission to do so. I was informed that we all had to be subscribers to this magazine, and that we could not sell this quilt top. We were not selling the quilt nor were we raffling it off to raise money. Quilt members of our group had to work on the quilt top, and we then drew one of our workers' names as the winner of the quilt.

    Here's where I think this magazine was wrong. Who were they going to sue? We were an informal group of seniors who were given donated space in a local building. Our group was not a guild in the sense that we did not have dues or bylaws or other financial obligations. Was this magazine going to sue a county agency, one without any monies to begin with? How stupid was their response?

    I immediately canceled my subscription, urging others to do the same. Here's my position. I can go to any library and copy that pattern for my personal use. The magazine itself purchased that pattern from the original designer. By displaying this magazine and the completed quilt, we were, in effect, helping to publicize that particular pattern (and the magazine too). What more could a designer ask?

    I am saddened that the quilt community is so wrapped up in this copyright debate. What ever happened to "fair usage" as a concept? Do the quilt police think they can control the consumers to that degree? If so, I will no longer purchase any patterns, looking to use those in the Public Domain. :cry:

  16. #116
    Super Member Ps 150's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    Upstate New York
    Posts
    1,411
    Quote Originally Posted by quilterguy27
    Another Mag with the same statement about who can make what for who and who has control over what you make. I've heard so many of you say you are cancelling your subscription of McCalls because of the copyright statement in the front of the magazine. Well, I just got my issue of Quilter's Home mag and it has the same statement in it. I'm only due one more issue and I won't be renewing my subscription to this mag or any other. I will be checking from now on. Thanks for the other thread about this topic! I just went and Googled Creative Crafts Group, LLC and Quilter's Home is under the same umbrella as McCalls as well as a bunch of other magazines, so if anyone else is thinking of discontinuing your subscription or for any other reason you might want to check them out, you can find out who has this statement in their magazine. Just my little rant. Thanks for listening!
    Where are these statements located in the magazines?

  17. #117
    Member
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Posts
    83
    Why do you even worry about those lunitoons?

    If and when they sue you (your club, your group, your whatever) they have to make a claim for DAMAGES. Don't settle. Let them prove that you have done damage to their commercial interests.

    Have fun with them.

    They can keep nice citizens in court for ever. Make it your entertainment project for your group to do the same to them. You don't need a lawyer. Just question their damage claim.

    Sooner or later THEY will be thrown out of court.

  18. #118
    Super Member amandasgramma's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    La Pine Oregon, USA
    Posts
    5,909
    Okay -- now here's another thought that I don't see mentioned. I worked with a woman that was teaching me web design. She was very well known in her area and in fact, does web pages for some of the people on TV. I eventually decided I didn't want to do it (boring), so I'll share this with you. The first thing she had me do was create my own web page. She had me add a copyright clause at the bottom. I questioned how that would work, that it costs $$ to get a copyright. She said "I know, but the person reading this may not know it's a worthless statement".......TAAADAAAAHHH.....I'm not worried about copyrights now. And yes, I WILL credit a magazine/designer, etc when I make something.

  19. #119
    Junior Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    fort wayne, indiana
    Posts
    132
    Blog Entries
    2
    what are the names of the magazines in question?

    Kandy

  20. #120
    Banned
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    Orange County, CA
    Posts
    642
    Quote Originally Posted by amandasgramma
    I questioned how that would work, that it costs $$ to get a copyright. She said "I know, but the person reading this may not know it's a worthless statement".......TAAADAAAAHHH.....I'm not worried about copyrights now.
    Not true at all. You don't have to pay to have a copyright. Once you create the work, then it is copyrighted (see #8 on the link below). Registering a copyright is what you're thinking of, and it is not necessary for the work to actually be copyrighted and protected by the law.

    http://www.keytlaw.com/Copyrights/top10myths.htm

  21. #121
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Manchester, NH
    Posts
    701
    Quote Originally Posted by amandasgramma
    Okay -- now here's another thought that I don't see mentioned. I worked with a woman that was teaching me web design. She was very well known in her area and in fact, does web pages for some of the people on TV. I eventually decided I didn't want to do it (boring), so I'll share this with you. The first thing she had me do was create my own web page. She had me add a copyright clause at the bottom. I questioned how that would work, that it costs $$ to get a copyright. She said "I know, but the person reading this may not know it's a worthless statement".......TAAADAAAAHHH.....I'm not worried about copyrights now. And yes, I WILL credit a magazine/designer, etc when I make something.
    I have this crazy vision in my head of these mags hiring people to scurry all over the country/world in search of quilts that have been made using their designs!
    :shock: :twisted:
    Just give credit to the designer of the design on the label and let them do their worst.

  22. #122
    Banned
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    Orange County, CA
    Posts
    642
    There are so many things that are similar in nature to this debate:

    - recipes. If I follow a recipe out of a book, does that mean I can't sell (or enter in the fair) the product of that recipe?

    - art instruction books. If I buy a book, and follow the instructions in it on how to draw a picture, does that mean I can't sell or display publicly the product of that work?

    - soap. There's tons of recipes out there for making handmade soap. Does that mean I can't follow someone else's instructions on how to make soap, and then sell the product?

    - web design/programming. I speak from this personally. If I follow the instructions in a book on how to do something programming related, does that mean I can't distribute/sell the end product if it includes that code?

    It all seems so ridiculous. People/companies sell instructions for items, so that other people can MAKE the product in question. They have copyright over the instructions themselves (meaning I can't copy the instructions and distribute them or sell them), but they should have NO control over the end product, in my opinion.

    These quilting magazines that are declaring ownership/control over the quilts that are made from their designs are claiming more control than is given to them from copyright, if you ask me. Just because they say it is so, doesn't make it so.

  23. #123
    Fancy Nancy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Location
    Illinois
    Posts
    351
    buying used quilt books from websites, garage sales and this forum - if they contain original quilt projects, is this not a violation? well - queen of violators here then, 'cause i have bought a lot of second hand books etc. call all quilt police...!

  24. #124
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    Texas
    Posts
    619
    Why don't we all just quit buying mags and patterns.

  25. #125

    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Posts
    601
    Quote Originally Posted by martha jo
    Why don't we all just quit buying mags and patterns.
    Well, I can answer that for myself at least. I don't see any reason to. They broaden my horizons, I learn tons even if I don't make the quilts inside, and I enjoy them! The things that seem to be annoying so many people on this board don't annoy me at all. I feel like this has become one giant game of telephone - with a lot of assumptions being made that just aren't true. Several people have very clearly and succinctly summarized copyright law for us, and yet the misinformation persists. I, for one, am not going to blame McCall's quilting, Quilter's Home, Fons and Porter, or any designer, for a copyright law that was written by a bunch of politicians in Washington, D.C., and I'm happy to credit and even ask permission of a designer to show his or her quilt if I thought enough of his or her design to make a copy of it.

Page 5 of 10 FirstFirst ... 4 5 6 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

SEO by vBSEO ©2011, Crawlability, Inc.